Author Topic: Peplins development  (Read 23594 times)

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Offline timpavlou

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Peplins development
« on: July 13, 2007, 01:44:18 pm »
A house in Peplins Way has recently been bought by a developer who has separated half the garden.

We fear the intention is to build a house on this tiny plot. No plans have been submitted yet.

Local residents are trying to get together to sign a petition.

We are writing to the estate agent concerned about selling homes to developers and hope many people follow.

I would like to try and do some sort of forum petition but I am new to this.

Can anyone help.

Thanks

Tim
« Last Edit: July 13, 2007, 02:24:09 pm by David Brewer »
 

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Re: Peplins development
« Reply #1 on: July 13, 2007, 02:26:13 pm »
Hi Tim,

Welcome to the forum.

I have edited you post slightly to remove comments on the behaviour of the developer and the estate agent.

As far as I know, selling property to developers is not illegal and neither is developing land, as long as the proper processes are carried out.

As far as petitions are concerned, a paper one is probably best.

David
« Last Edit: July 13, 2007, 02:33:09 pm by David Brewer »
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Offline Mark_Eric

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Re: Peplins development
« Reply #2 on: July 13, 2007, 03:12:43 pm »
David
I have posted on this topic, under the 'flats in Brookmans Park' section. Surely Tim's point is not whether selling off part of your garden to developers is legal, the point is whether it is desirable to the community as a whole. Particularly to the people living next to the development. Sub-dividing plots is big in New Zealand and it spoils the feel of a street and the view of neighbours. There are no plus points for doing this sort of development other than making money for a developer.

I also wonder why comments on the behaviour of people can not be aired on this site, unless they are vicious or rude. It sounds like censorship.
 

Offline flw67

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Re: Peplins development
« Reply #3 on: July 13, 2007, 04:52:15 pm »
Are you allowed to say what number it is, cant say I've noticed it.
 

Offline sasquartch

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Re: Peplins development
« Reply #4 on: July 13, 2007, 05:01:34 pm »
As a Peplins Way resident I too am completely against this sort of thing.

However, who would the petition be directed at ?

The estate agents concerned I am sure have only, in general terms, an interest in earning commission for a client and don't really care about the views of the neighbours.

If a tiny plot is built on and someone is willing to buy it with a 15 foor back garden then so be it.

Hopefully it will prove that number 46 won't sell because any prospective buyer will consider half a million pounds for a house with half the garden missing is too much.

The only hope for a petition is that it influences the outcome of any planning application - and hopefully will be turned down on the grounds of overdevelopment. However, until there is an application I'm not sure how a petition would be practical.

When and if an application is submitted I will almost certainly sign it though !!



 

Offline Bob Horrocks

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Re: Peplins development
« Reply #5 on: July 13, 2007, 05:16:54 pm »
Be assured that North Mymms Parish Council carefully checks every planning application in the parish.  NMPC usually objects to 'back land' development but each case is considered on its own merits.

'Back land developments' do sometimes get approved by Welwyn Hatfield Council - the planning authority - but many are refused.  Two recent approvals, where the houses have now been built, are in Nash Close and Knolles Crescent, Welham Green.  These were more 'side land' rather than what is usually considered as 'back land'.  If the Peplins Way property is the one I have been alerted to, that is also a 'side land' project.

Recent refusals were in Kentish Lane and The Gardens - the latter also having been refused on appeal.

Petitions can be useful, but it could be argued that people sign without much knowledge of the subject.  It is far better for individual objection letters to be sent.  I have sometimes drafted a letter of objection which was circulated to neighbours and produced lots of letters being sent to Welwyn Hatfield Council. 

Anything done before a planning application is made is a waste of time.  Welwyn Hatfield cannot do anything about objections to what is conjecture. 

The plus point is that 'windfall' housing eases the pressure on the Green Belt.

Offline flw67

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Re: Peplins development
« Reply #6 on: July 13, 2007, 06:52:12 pm »
I see 46 has put in for planning permission for an extension, surely that can leave much room for another house?
 

Offline sasquartch

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Re: Peplins development
« Reply #7 on: July 13, 2007, 08:14:02 pm »
The back garden has already been 'annexed'. There is already a dropped kerb as access from the linkway part of Peplins.

The planning permission is for a side extension. The property is up for sale with Andrew Ward,presumably to have planning permssion as a selling point. Obviously it will end up as a very big house with a small garden.
 

Offline Mark_Eric

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Re: Peplins development
« Reply #8 on: July 13, 2007, 08:32:15 pm »
I would be interested to hear more from bob about the letter he drafted that was circulated to neighbours. I agree that if the council received lots of individual letters it would be much more impressive than a petition. Apart from the obvious objections, the traffic chaos that would ensue on that narrow part of Peplins would be horrendous, particularly at school time. As a resident of Peplins Way why should my neighbours and I suffer inconvenience in order that somebody should make money.
 

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Re: Peplins development
« Reply #9 on: July 13, 2007, 09:51:05 pm »

It sounds like censorship.


Or just minor moderation. It happens all the time on forums.

 ;)

David


« Last Edit: July 14, 2007, 07:18:36 am by David Brewer »
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Offline Mark_Eric

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Re: Peplins development
« Reply #10 on: July 14, 2007, 08:54:19 am »
Or just minor moderation. It happens all the time on forums.

But Why?
 

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Re: Peplins development
« Reply #11 on: July 14, 2007, 09:28:52 am »
Or just minor moderation. It happens all the time on forums.

But Why?

Hi Mark,

Just being cautious. The post lost nothing in its meaning with the removal of a couple of words that could have been taken the wrong way by various parties and could, possibly, be seen as defamatory.

David
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Re: Peplins development
« Reply #12 on: July 14, 2007, 10:35:14 am »
I've started a thread on Forum Censorship so as not to divert this thread away from the developments in Peplins.
 

Offline timpavlou

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Re: Peplins development
« Reply #13 on: July 14, 2007, 04:28:11 pm »
what censorrship ? the number of the house has been mentioned as has the Estate Agent.

We are now aware that plans have been submitted to the council for a 3 bed detached house.
This should appear on the wel/hat planning web page in the next few days. As far as i can see, and i live
next door, there is no space for a rear garden on this tiny plot.

Petitions are currently going around to the residents in Peplins & Bradmore Way and i think we have about
100 signitures (in 2 days), who are opposing any development in BP gardens. I think its up to individuals
to get onto the planning website and post their objections asap.

Tim
 

Offline timpavlou

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Re: Peplins development
« Reply #14 on: July 15, 2007, 10:06:07 am »
Anyone know who wishes to sign the petition  can do so at the village newsagent.

It seems that any corner plot is now at risk from this developer !

Tim

 

Offline Grumpy Old Roy

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Re: Peplins development
« Reply #15 on: July 15, 2007, 12:59:22 pm »
 
My wife and I have signed the petition re the proposed Pepplins Way development. Having moved to BP from Hadley Wood to due its ongoing development, 6 houses on a 2 house site, 16 on 1 house site, 12 on another and so on. In 20 years our immediate area changed quite dramatically, in fact it is now called, Hadley without Wood, so we are quite aware of the dangers of developments.  Remember, 1 new house means 2 or more cars, extra demands on services, traffic schools and so on.

All new infills must be resisted vigorously if we wish to retain the character of BP. Would a public meeting be of any use to inform our councilors that if they wish to retain our support they bring pressure on planning to block all applications of these nature.

Grumpy Old Roy

   
 

Offline timpavlou

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Re: Peplins development
« Reply #16 on: July 17, 2007, 03:48:39 pm »
here's the case no. for the proposed det. 3 bed house on 46 peplins way.

S6/2007/1063?FP.

 

Offline sasquartch

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Re: Peplins development
« Reply #17 on: July 17, 2007, 04:44:36 pm »
I just looked at the www.welhat.gov.uk site and could see the application, but no drawings.

As far as objections are concerned it would be useful to find out what are valid objections would be - can Bob Horrocks or anyone else advise ?

I think there is little point in vague complaints, we need things like parking provisions, proximity to schools, blocking of light to adjacent properties, that sort of thing.

I am sure if enough people submit well reasoned objections there will be a good chance the application can be refused.
 

Offline sasquartch

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Re: Peplins development
« Reply #18 on: July 20, 2007, 12:26:53 pm »
The drawings are now available to view online.

Not suprisingly the garden is tiny, in fact the house is larger than the back garden !

The frontage is also substantially nearer the road than the adjoining property so will look very squeezed in.
« Last Edit: July 20, 2007, 08:30:10 pm by sasquartch »
 

Offline Bob Horrocks

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Re: Peplins development
« Reply #19 on: July 20, 2007, 05:47:42 pm »
Have just got back from a few days away so I cannot comment yet.

Offline Cassie

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Re: Peplins development
« Reply #20 on: July 21, 2007, 08:11:29 am »

here's the case no. for the proposed det. 3 bed house on 46 peplins way.

S6/2007/1063?FP.


It should read S6/2007/1063/FP

There's also another one:

S6/2007/0680/FP
 

Offline timpavlou

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Re: Peplins development
« Reply #21 on: July 22, 2007, 09:22:56 am »
The next priority is to send in individual comments of objection to : planning@welhat.gov.uk
or write to CJ Conway, WHBC, Council Offices, The Campus Welwyn Garden City , Herts. AL8 6AE to reach by 6th Aug. Always quote ref: S6/2007/1063/FP.

I have spoken to an architect, solicitor and Surveyor  and these are some of the comments to include.

1. The proposed dev. is not in keeping with the character & size of other houses on  the road and will prove an   eyesore. This will also be accentuated by site position of becoming the last house in the street.

2. All houses are semi's and stepped back from each other by 1 metre. This proposal steps forward by 3 metres
from the building line and only 6m from the boundary line. This forms an appearance of the street narrowing at
the site and the impression of open space and airiness is lost.

3. The distance between no. 46 and proposed dev. side is approx. 15m and would cause overlooking  & be too near to the adjoining property.

4. If permission were granted it would have a lasting and a detrimental impact on the community as it would set a precedent for every corner plot to be developed  thus increasing mass and density to BP.

5. The proposal has a minimal garden which again is not in keeping with the houses of peplins way. This mayl have the effect of more disturbance and activity on the street as leisure and recreational activities mayl be transferred to the road .

6. The additional house and any future proposals  would also reduce parking space on the street during school drop off and collection times causing further congestion problems and also become more hazardous for children.

Any additional comments you think may be useful please post.
The M.P.'s case worker and a local Councillor have both been made aware of this applicaion.

Tim 
 

Offline sasquartch

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Re: Peplins development
« Reply #22 on: September 10, 2007, 10:05:21 am »
I see this has been refused.

This is excellent news as far as I am concerned and hopefully it sends a clear message to developers.

The decision is below :

1. The design and appearance of the dwelling fails to reflect the design of existing dwellings in the area and would result in a dominant and incongruous feature. The proposed dwelling would not relate acceptably to the scale and character of existing dwellings in the vicinity by virtue of its scale and bulk contrary to Policy D1 of the Welwyn Hatfield District Plan 2005.

2. The proposed development would result in unacceptable loss of amenity as a result of overlooking to the garden and living areas of No.44 and No.46 Peplins Way contrary to Policy D1 of the Welwyn Hatfield District Plan 2005.

3. The outlook from kitchen window would be severely restricted and the presence of the fence would also result in loss of daylight to this room resulting in unacceptable living conditions for future occupants. The proposals fail to provide adequate living conditions for the prospective residents contrary to Policy D1 of the Welwyn Hatfield District Plan 2005.

4. The proposed development would give rise to an undesirably cramped appearance within a spacious street scene as a result of overdevelopment of the site. The small dimensions of the application site are not in keeping with the generous plot sizes that characterise the area. The proposed dwelling would fail to respect existing spacing and would be visually intrusive and unsympathetic to the character of the area. The proposed dwelling would form an incongruous feature jutting out from the building line to the detriment of the spacious street scene in particular when viewed from east to west. The precedent likely to be created by granting of permission would lead to the erosion of the character and context of the area. The proposal is therefore contrary to Policy D2 of the Welwyn Hatfield District Plan 2005.

5. The amenity space proposed would not provide adequate living conditions for future residents and the close boarded fence would result in oppressively enclosed garden for a house of this size and type. The proposal, by virtue of its location, does not provide any rear garden space. The only private amenity space is to the west of the building, in a semi private area. The proposal is therefore contrary to Policies D1 and D3 of the Welwyn Hatfield District Plan 2005.

REFUSED PLAN NUMBER(S): 105/07/10 received and date stamped 13 July 2007.

 

Offline Bob Horrocks

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Re: Peplins development
« Reply #23 on: September 10, 2007, 11:25:32 am »
I had posted similar on the 'Flats in BP' topic which I have now deleted.  I would add these comments.

Interestingly, the paragraph on its cramped appearannce said it jutted out from the building line to the detriment of the spacious street scene.  The precedent likely to be created if approved would lead to the erosion of the character and context of the area.  That is something to keep in mind when further applications are inevitably made for building on gardens in the parish.

The poor outlook due to close proximity of the fence and lack of amenity were some of the reasons why a Planning Inspector dismissed an appeal to build a bungalow in the rear garden of 15 The Gardens which would have fronted onto Oaklands Avenue. Nice to see consistancy.

Offline sasquartch

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Re: Peplins development
« Reply #24 on: September 10, 2007, 03:41:35 pm »
Bob

Regarding the refused plans for the Peplins development, is this likely to mean that permission will never be granted - that is, could a plan for a smaller house be submitted which might then get permission granted ?

It's hard to imagine any house, however small, being suited for such a tiny plot - however the developer will presumably want to do something with the land as (unless converted back into a garden) it's pretty useless.
 

Offline Bob Horrocks

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Re: Peplins development
« Reply #25 on: September 11, 2007, 10:32:05 am »
Good question, Sasquartch, but that is now a problem for the developer who should have had a 'plan B'. 

It is interesting that Welwyn Hatfield Council appears to be more comprehensive in giving reasons for refusal, possibly to make it difficult for someone to win an appeal against refusal.  The 'Friday Grove country house' appeal case was partly argued that the reasons for refusal were inadequate.

Apparently number 46 has now been sold with the shorter garden so it is an isolated piece of land.

Offline Bob Horrocks

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Re: Peplins development
« Reply #26 on: September 26, 2007, 10:58:18 am »
What a surprise!

A new planning application S6/2007/1406 has just been submitted for a 2-bedroom detached house on land at the rear of 46 Peplins Way.  the Welwyn Hatfield website shows that many houses in Peplins Way have been notified, being all the people who wrote to the council about the previous application.

The drawings are not yet on the www.welhat.gov.uk website so it is not possible to see what changes have been made apart from the reduction from 3 to 2 bedrooms.

The reasons for refusing the previous application have been posted above by Sasquartch.

Offline sasquartch

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Re: Peplins development
« Reply #27 on: September 26, 2007, 01:55:57 pm »
It's hard to see how any development, 2 bedroom or otherwise would not also fail to meet planning requirements - given the size of plot for example it would always fail point 4 (see earlier post detailing reasons for refusal)

Hopefully if the same number of people object then this new plan will be refused as well.
 

Offline southbury

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Re: Peplins development
« Reply #28 on: September 27, 2007, 07:11:32 am »
Whatever Estate Agents and  Industry Surveys say at present we are about to get a real correction in the UK Housing market .. any developer worth his salt will realise this . Mortgage lenders in Q1 2008 will have to pass on higher borrowing costs or see their margins greatly reduced and Credit conditions in the retail / mortgage sectors are going to get squeezed .. hopefully pulling down houses and replacing them with flats in the village is going to look far less appealing over the next couple of years.
 

Offline Grumpy Old Roy

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Re: Peplins development
« Reply #29 on: September 28, 2007, 01:05:18 pm »
 
I have just received notification of a revised proposal for No 46. Do you want us to            reply individually again with our objections ?

Grumpy Old Roy
 

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