Author Topic: McDonalds Car Park in Potters Bar  (Read 15917 times)

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Offline peppermint

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McDonalds Car Park in Potters Bar
« on: April 04, 2007, 10:19:27 am »
Just a warning to anyone who uses McDonalds car park in Potters Bar.

If you see a stocky man in motor bike gear in the vicinity of the car park (his bike is usually parked in one of the bays at the back of the restaurant), please beware.   I have seen him taking photos of cars and would therefore assume he is a parking attendant.

It would appear that he does this regardless of whether you are a McDonalds customer or not!!!
 

Offline shelfsidelower

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Re: McDonalds Car Park in Potters Bar
« Reply #1 on: April 06, 2007, 11:28:11 pm »
good shout. he most certainly is. he works for UKPC. they are a private firm working on behalf of mcdonalds. 2 months ago i parked my car in the mcdonalds parking space at the back. i walked straight pased this same fella you mentioned, who looked at me and said nothing as he sat on the wall. i queued up at barclays cashpoint and then took my youngest son into mcdonlds for lunch. came out 15 mins later and the greasy git had slapped a ticket on me. i approached him as he sat stuffing his face with a steak and kidney, and asked him why he did that when he actually watched me walk past. his reply was "you didnt walk to mcdonalds, you went to the bank. the fact i had to get money from the cashpoint before i went in there meant nothing to him. its an £85 fine and if not paid within 2 weeks it goes up to £170. i made the mistake of not getting a receipt at mcdonalds at the time. i'm contesting it and am still waiting to hear. if you do get one off the pie-muncher, just go into mcdonalds, buy a small milkshake and get a receipt. what is this country coming to?? grrrrrr!!
 

Offline Oly

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Re: McDonalds Car Park in Potters Bar
« Reply #2 on: April 12, 2007, 11:16:04 am »
They got me in cuffley behind the parade of shops, same firm UKPC but the Road traffic act does not apply to private firms so I am refusing to pay it. There was no signs to say no parking or permits only and the only no parking signs were in front of peoples garages and I stayed clear of them.

Ive changed the owner of my car so they cant take it away from me lol
 

Offline trainee barrister!

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Re: McDonalds Car Park in Potters Bar
« Reply #3 on: May 26, 2007, 01:09:27 am »
good shout. he most certainly is. he works for UKPC. they are a private firm working on behalf of mcdonalds. 2 months ago i parked my car in the mcdonalds parking space at the back. i walked straight pased this same fella you mentioned, who looked at me and said nothing as he sat on the wall. i queued up at barclays cashpoint and then took my youngest son into mcdonlds for lunch. came out 15 mins later and the greasy git had slapped a ticket on me. i approached him as he sat stuffing his face with a steak and kidney, and asked him why he did that when he actually watched me walk past. his reply was "you didnt walk to mcdonalds, you went to the bank. the fact i had to get money from the cashpoint before i went in there meant nothing to him. its an £85 fine and if not paid within 2 weeks it goes up to £170. i made the mistake of not getting a receipt at mcdonalds at the time. i'm contesting it and am still waiting to hear. if you do get one off the pie-muncher, just go into mcdonalds, buy a small milkshake and get a receipt. what is this country coming to?? grrrrrr!!


 ::)Hi
just wondered how you got on with your appeal and if you managed to get it cancelled?  This happened to me and several other people I've spoken to.  We didn't have a notice placed on the car but got one in the post 2 weeks later -with a pay up or else attitude.  We are all appealing  this on the grounds of them being issued illegally and have carried out the research to back us up -just wondered how many other people out there have been hit with unfair fines by parking on private car parks?  There are new laws coming out in October to stop this carrying on. 

PS Did you know McDonalds get paid a commission for each successful fine UKPC Ltd dish out?? 


Edit to remove [/font]
« Last Edit: May 26, 2007, 11:33:49 pm by Bob »
 

Offline Oly

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Re: McDonalds Car Park in Potters Bar
« Reply #4 on: May 29, 2007, 12:00:55 am »
I can confirm that this firm operates on "Toy town language" they cannot enforce a ticket, 2 months on they are demanding 195 from me. This is some info that I received.

UK Parking Control are currently running second in an annual "Highwayman" awards and without proper signage their claim is probably unenforceable.

In any event you have committed no offence and any penalty would need to be brought for breach of contract under civil law - the contract tacit in your parking there and thus accepting very prominently published terms and conditions. If these are not prominently published then it is unlikely that you would be deemed in breach. Furthermore many of the practices used -- sham appeals procedure, escalating charges by extortionate collection costs, the use of the term "fines" -- have been deemed to fall foul of the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999.

Many of these companies also fail to follow the rules of protected terms under law and as such they commit a criminal offence under the The Administration of Justice Act 1970 which states under Section 1(d) as follows:
(1) A person commits an offence if, with the object of coercing another person to pay money claimed from the other as a debt due under a contract,
....
(d) utters a document falsely represented by him to have some official character or purporting to have some official character which he knows it has not.

Furthermore in the case of private parking operators where registered keeper details have been obtained from the DVLA, there is no obligation on the keeper to identify the driver. Despite claims to the contrary it is very doubtful that the keeper, if not the driver nor present at the time, could have been deemed to have been bound into any contract.

In any event, ultimately the "debt" can only be enforced through an action brought in the County Court, and our usual recommendation is that you demand they issue proceedings within 14 days or cease any further contact. This should put a stop to the ever-spiralling charges and debt collectors fees they may seek to impose.

Please remember that in such cases words are cheap and threats of future legal action are common. No penalty can be imposed without the case going to court so the only important document is the actual County Court claim - not any paper issued by UKPC or any of their agencies threatening this. In the unlikely event that they issue proceedings then you must file a defence (which is free) and probably based on the lack of signage.
Once a defence has been filed then you are already showing yourself to be serious and any further action on their part will involve serious costs with no guarantee of recovering a relatively small amount. Thus the case is unlikely to go much further.

Under section 40 of the RTA UKPC tickets are not enforceable. They run their own appeals hence why it is a sham when appealing.
« Last Edit: May 29, 2007, 12:03:46 am by Oly »
 

Offline Aidan Winwood

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Re: McDonalds Car Park in Potters Bar
« Reply #5 on: June 04, 2007, 11:50:04 pm »
Very interesting note Oly.  Thank you.

Aidan
 

Offline trainee barrister!

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Re: McDonalds Car Park in Potters Bar
« Reply #6 on: June 06, 2007, 06:56:31 pm »
Hi Oly and thanks

Totally agree with you -you seem to know the law well are you a solicitor?

Using similar legal terms, I actually got a letter of apology from UKPC and they agreed to cancel the parking charge!  I now want to help other innocent motorists get theirs cancelled or their money refunded.

UKPC's membership body the BPA are investigating this company as we speak -and I thought it would be useful for anyone else who has experienced similar problems with this parking company to report them to the BPA marked for the attention of Jane Hicks (Membership Director) at this address: jane.h@britishparking.co.uk

This is certainly highway robbery at its best and this company is making a huge fortune out of the general public's ignorance of the law.

Lets hope we achieve justice 

Trainee Barrister!!
« Last Edit: June 07, 2007, 01:10:53 am by trainee barrister! »
 

Offline Oly

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Re: McDonalds Car Park in Potters Bar
« Reply #7 on: June 08, 2007, 11:59:34 am »
Im a sales person, I got this info about the parking ticket people off the internet. UKPC have no right to get the drivers information from the DVLA. The only people who are allowed to access the information about drivers are the law enforcement agencies, not some private parking firm.
 

Offline sasquartch

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Re: McDonalds Car Park in Potters Bar
« Reply #8 on: June 08, 2007, 01:26:38 pm »
My wife got a ticket from the parking company who look after the Galleria car park.

Although it was cancelled after a phone call to the management it suprised me that a private company can get access to DVLA data.
 

Offline trainee barrister!

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Re: McDonalds Car Park in Potters Bar
« Reply #9 on: June 08, 2007, 11:10:45 pm »
Hi again
Just for the record, as long as a company is signed up to the DVLA (after paying the initial few thousand pounds to join) and shows 'reasonable cause' for requesting Registered Keeper/Owner details (NOT DRIVER) from the DVLA, the DVLA get paid £2.50 every time they hand out our details.  They've made a staggering £9 million since 2002  - take a look at:

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/news/article.html?in_article_id=415902&in_page_id=2

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=369838&in_page_id=1770

http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=369177&in_page_id=1770

I get so angry when I see the abuse going on and people constantly being blackmailed by these parking companies when parking on private land. This is not covered under Traffic Law.  I can't understand why private parking companies should be allowed access to our personal data unless they have a 'lawful' basis to access our details.

If you are reading Grant, perhaps you could help change the law so our personal information remains secure and private.

What ever happened to our human rights under the Human Rights Law 1998 and Data Protection Act 1998 where there must be a 'lawful' basis for data sharing...this is not lawful, it's blackmail?
Any comments?
 

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