Bradmore Green one-way Proposal

[Editor]

Hertfordshire Highways is considering a request for a one-way system to be introduced on some roads around Brookmans Park’s Bradmore Green.

If it went ahead, it would mean that the east sides of each of the triangles of grass would become one-way only, with the other roads remaining two-way.

The two roads that have been suggested for being made one-way are the road in front of the library and the road running in front of Statons.

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[trinity]

Seems entirely reasonable.

[jet]

One way traffic is fast traffic
regards,
jet

[trinity]

One way traffic is fast traffic
regards

Given that the roads are full of shop staff's vehicles, a couple of humps should sort out that one.

[Alfred the Great]

Seems funny that HH can afford to think about doing the job but not to actually do it - surely eight grey metal tubes with round signs on the top don't cost that much?

ATG

[Editor]

surely eight grey metal tubes with round signs on the top don't cost that much?

Hi ATG, I think it is a matter of priorities, which, I understand , are determined by the number of accidents/incidents. Someone suggested this project sits about 76 in the list of 100 most important issues for Hertfordshire Highways to tackle.

[trinity]

Hi ATG, I think it is a matter of priorities, which, I understand , are determined by the number of accidents/incidents. Someone suggested this project sits about 76 in the list of 100 most important issues for Hertfordshire Highways to tackle.

Maybe this is an example of a case where "community action" might be valuable. ISTM that with access to the poles, signs, and some roadpaint, we could organise a local volunteer team to do the job on a weekend.

[Spurs fan]

I'm in favour of making those roads one-way, but surely it would be better to have the road in front of the library one-way the other way? i.e. you are able to turn into it from the greengrocers end not the Andrew Ward end. This would keep the parking on the left, and not on the 'wrong' side of the road as it would be if you entered from Brookmans Avenue.
Plus, there's probably a psychological reason for keeping it clockwise!

[Margaret]

Not quite sure why a one-way system is needed, if people drive courteously it isn't a problem and as Jet says a one-way system will encourage faster driving as they know it is one way and they are unlikely to meet a car coming the other way. Also as the only time it is exceptionaly busy is at school time do we really want anybody going more than a few miles an hour when there are lots of children around crossing roads. At the moment you have to go slowly and take extra care  which is surely a good thing in the village centre. Also at other times there are elderly people around who take time to cross the roads, so making it easier for motorists rather than pedestrians is not a good idea in my book. So I for one would object to any plans to make the village centre just another vehicle friendly place.

[Bob Horrocks]

Highways have this on their list as a congestion spot, but it has a low ranking because there have been no injuries to people there.  They said they will do another assessment to update the last one in 1999.  

It is also busy there at lunchtime with workers getting their lunch at the local bakery etc.  

[jet]

Ho hum life is so exciting in BP, a one way system, yawn, be still my beating heart, i cannot take such inovation, imagine the cost,
regards,
jet

[liketoretire]

RE the one way system debate ..

When this issue last came up the big drawback was and still is the amount of road signs that would be required.
Can you imagine the blue one way signs and the red no entry signs that would be required?

The phrase "sign pollution" springs to mind.  Mind you the local canine population would appreciate it. It wouln't solve the parking problem either.
I my view the council should come to an arrangement with The BP hotel to lease some of their forecourt for a shop staff parking area, thereby freeing up spaces for genuine shoppers and making the triangle less congested.

[sasquartch]

Why would the BP hotel want to lease out their carpark ? They have recently invested what must have been a substantial amount of money in resurfacing it so obviously feel they need the space. I would have thought that spaces would be needed throughout the day and night.

[Phil_Holm]

Is the conjestion so bad???

Can't believe it's worth all the agro.

And what's the real benefit???

Phil

[Margaret]

That's just it Phil the congestion isn't that bad, the only time it's a problem is due once again to the odd bad driver and they will be a bad driver no matter how much money is wasted on new one way systems and road signs. Most of the driving problems in this area or caused by just a few.

[trinity]

That's just it Phil the congestion isn't that bad, the only time it's a problem is due once again to the odd bad driver and they will be a bad driver no matter how much money is wasted on new one way systems and road signs. Most of the driving problems in this area or caused by just a few.

Look on the bright side. Having the place totally clogged with parked cars does tend to keep the speed of the moving ones to a minimum.

On the other hand, given that a significant proportion of those parked cars belong to people who work in the shops and such, it isn't clear to me what can be done about it without either shunting them off to the railway station (how ? at gunpoint ?), or having them clutter up Oaklands and Peplins and so on instead.

[supersonic]

I'd agree that the issue of parking rather than one way signage is the priority. I came into BP the other day to post some parcels and get a sarnie from Jan's Pantry. Could I find a place to park?? No chance!! I gave up - went back to Welham Green. Result - BP traders lost my trade and lost out on my money.

Perhaps the money that the council want to spend on this scheme could go towards some pay and display machines? Controversial I know, but I'd be willing to pay say 20p to be able to park for 20 mins. More than enough time to do a bit of local shopping, and hopefully also enough of a deterrent to dissuade the local shop staff from clogging up local parking as well. I also accept however that p&d can be the thin edge of the wedge. Local to me in Harrow the council are slowly condemning the town centre to oblivion with extortionate, crippling and excessive p&d parking rates of 30p for 10 mins!!!

supersonic

[trinity]

Perhaps the money that the council want to spend on this scheme could go towards some pay and display machines? Controversial I know, but I'd be willing to pay say 20p to be able to park for 20 mins.

The trouble with that is that there would be an (at least initial) reaction against the measure - and the only beneficiaries of that reaction would be the likes of Tescos and Sainsburys in PB.

This is probably OK if you're the vet, one of the hairdressers or even (hopefully) Bryan. It is less OK if you're the Co-op. Which would be particularly bad for those to whom the distance to the Green is far from being a formudable walk.

[sasquartch]

Surely the answer is to put single yellow lines on all the roads in the village.
Make the time limit 2 hours.
The shopkeepers and people working in the village (ie people who aren't shoppers) will park elsewhere, anyone wanting to shop will have plenty of time to do their shopping and hopefully have some chance of parking.
OK, yellow lines aren't that pretty but surely preferable to loads of no-entry and one-way signs.

[trinity]

Surely the answer is to put single yellow lines on all the roads in the village.
Make the time limit 2 hours.
The shopkeepers and people working in the village (ie people who aren't shoppers) will park elsewhere

True. They'll clutter up Peplins and Oaklands and Westlands instead, just like the commuters already do who seem to reckon that the station car park will eat their loved ones.

[shads]

Trinity,i am not one that parks in the BP station car park,or on the streets as i pay the extortionate amount of £3.50 per day to park in Potters Bar station car park.'
The reason i do this is becauce i had my car vandalised and if that wasn't enough it was stolen when parked in the BP station car park,so i now have the extra incovienence and expense of driving to Potters Bar.At least the Potters Bar car park has cameras though not sure how effeciently they work as i often see glass on the tarmac,however i have yet to have a problem there.
The reason i mention this is because some commuters are probably worried about leaving their car in the BP car park so hence park it somewhere nearby in a less secluded spot.
I'm not saying its right but i can understand why they do it.

[trinity]

The reason i mention this is because some commuters are probably worried about leaving their car in the BP car park so hence park it somewhere nearby in a less secluded spot.

Thereby dumping their problem on someone else. Maybe this vandalism lark isn't such a bad idea after all.

Your solution, as well as being more honourable, also buys you better trains (or would if WAGN didn't wreck services to PB after 1630).

[Margaret]

I drive my daughter to Potters Bar station every morning and collect her every evening as she can not afford to pay £3.50 a day for the car park on top of the £2000  for the annual train fare, also I know of two incidents in this car park and both car owners were told that the cameras don't work, these two incidents were at least 2 years apart and the cameras have never worked. So I'm afraid your car is not much safer in Potters Bar despite the rising cost.

[Editor]

Surely the answer is to put single yellow lines on all the roads in the village.
Make the time limit 2 hours.

But are there the traffic wardens to enforce any penalties on those exceeding the time limit set by yellow line restrictions and pay and display?

[Bob Horrocks]

In response to a suggestion from the parish council, Herts Highways is proposing that two slip roads at Bradmore Green are made 'one-way'.  One will flow from Peplins Way to Brookmans Ave in front of the library.  the other will continue in the same direction in front of Statons estate agents with traffic flwing from Brookmans Avenue to Bluebridge Road.  All other roads will remain two-way.

Shop keepers have been notified as part of the consulation on this idea.

[ADM]

Veteran forum readers will recall that we have been here before.

I've considered this proposal and I can't really understand the problem that it is trying to address.  I can think of three problems as things are now:

1. It IS difficult to park outside the shops at certain times of the day. 
2. You do sometimes have to reverse to allow another car access. 
3. There can be a lot of cars moving around an area which can have a lot of pedestrians, particularly schoolchildren.

1.  Use the car park by the station which is still free despite all we've heard to the contrary.  This propoal is actually likely to make parking worse anyway, as the thought of less reversing and faster-moving traffic may attract more cars.

2. Get over it.  That is the nature of a small village centre.  It's not meant to be an urban clearway.  Whilst the proposal may prevent some slow speed manoeuvring of vehicles, that is a good thing when we look at the third problem...

3. Because of the uncertainty of the road being clear, people reversing etc, people do drive more slowly than they otherwise might.  As Sir Robert Mark might say 'I believe that this is a positive contribution to road safety.'

To conclude, I can't see the point.  Also I don't want more flaming street furniture in the way of one way signs, no entry signs, and whatever other junk comes with it. 

I'm sure that I've missed something though...

[Editor]

I've merged this thread with an existing thread on the issue so that people can see what has been proposed and discussed in the past.

David

[Max]

I've often thought that a one way system in the village would be a fairly good idea. I don't think I can remember a day when it would be possible for two cars going in opposite directions to pass each other on one of the roads in question, and it is hardly as if the resulting detour (for some people) would be time or fuel consuming.

As for parking in the village, my advice for the able-bodied would be to do what I did when I lived in BP, which is to say, cycle. Surely no-one has to travel a significant distance to go to the village? And it isn't the kind of place you drive to to buy the week's shopping, is it?

An awful lot of local parking and traffic problems could be resolved by more people realising that it is perfectly possible to make small journeys without using the car, even when carrying medium size packages.

[Bob Horrocks]

ADM is correct that this idea has been raised before and dropped.

It is now out for consultation and, if it gets the go-ahead, the work has been penciled in for Spring 2006.

I agree about even more street furniture, and the CPRE is running a campaign to reduce this blot on the pavement nationally.

The only thing I would add is that we do not suffer from a mass of advert hoardings seen in America for instance.

[Max]

Try as I might, I can see no harm in "street furniture", nor see why it should be considered a "blot on the pavement". I certainly could not imagine myself ever saying "That used to be such a beautiful pavement and then they stuck a no entry sign in the middle of it!"

I totally agree with the notion of putting yellow lines in residentual roads like Peplins Way or Westland Drive. I can't think of a house in BP that doesn't have a drive big enough for two cars, or even three if you put one in the garage. How much parking space does a single household require, for goodness sake? Either that or make it residents parking only.