Author Topic: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre  (Read 278446 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline sasquartch

  • Forum Moderator
  • Opinions on everything
  • *****
  • Posts: 1416
  • Thanked: 23 times
  • Brookmans Park Forum Member
Re: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre
« Reply #30 on: June 24, 2003, 01:00:37 pm »
I know from the posts in this thread that ADSL is available in BP, yet when I tried to sign up I was told I live too far from the exchange. I'm in Peplins Way. Has anyone in the Peplins area got ADSL ?
 

Midnight

  • Guest
Re: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre
« Reply #31 on: June 25, 2003, 12:09:00 am »
Over 5.5Km?  Have you run the ADSL service check at BT's web site?  I was also over the cable distance but because BT had agreed the installation with my ISP, they went ahead anyway.  The service is spot on AFAIAC.  It might be worth badgering them a bit because the 5.5Km thing probably gives BT a fair bit of leeway (for poor cable quality).  For all I/we know, they could drive  ADSL the extra half mile to your location.
 

John_fraser

  • Guest
Re: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre
« Reply #32 on: June 26, 2003, 11:30:25 pm »
Thatís better, at last Iím back on line at home. Iíll let you know what happened, because there is a morel in this and a tip. It seems BT made a mistake and took down a lot Zen users on Sunday morning. They corrected their mistake the same day and most of those effected were back on line shortly afterwards.

But not yours truly. I appear to have suffered a ďstale sessionĒ where the BT system thought Iím connect when wasnít, so when I tried to connect it wouldnít let me. Apparently the way to get around these things is to log in as:

bt_test@startup_domain

Use any old password and it will clear your session and let you connect with your correct username and password. Only it didnít work. So today, which I had off anyway I called Zen support and tried connecting while they monitored the line. This convinced them it was a stale session which would need BT to fix, and hey presto Iím back to do battle with JET.

The Morels
1 - This is the first problem Iíve had with ADSL Ė in 9 months Ė and Zenís support was excellent. But they only work 9-5 Monday to Saturday. Which oddly enough Ė so do I. Iím not sure how long it would have taken to diagnose and fix if I hadnít had a day off to talk to them while I was on the PC. Iím not saying donít use Zen Ė as I really like their service Ė but look at the quality and hours of the support line, because when you need it, you really need it.

2 - If, like me you swap to a router, keep your ADSL modem handy. Rooter make it a lot harder to find out where the failure is.

3 Ė If internet access is important, use an ISP with a backup dial up connection and donít throw away you 56k modem.
 

Rob

  • Guest
Re: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre
« Reply #33 on: September 16, 2003, 12:47:44 am »
I live in Peplins Way and according to the BT web site, although the exchange has broadband ADSL, the length of the telephone line between me and the exchange is too long for broadband ADSL.
Has anyone else experienced this and overcome it?
 

Offline James Bentall

  • Opinions on everything
  • *****
  • Posts: 1199
  • Thanked: 29 times
  • Gender: Male
  • Keep :-)
    • Brookmans Park Newsletter
Re: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre
« Reply #34 on: September 16, 2003, 01:26:50 am »
You must be pretty close to the boundary - I am running broadband quite happily (using the excellent and highly recommended zen internet - zen.co.uk) from Bradmore Green with no problems. Might be worth making enquiries to BT - if there is little 'noise' on the line you might be in luck.

James
James Bentall, Brookmans Park, Herts.
I post in a personal capacity and not on behalf of North Mymms Parish Council
 

Offline Johnny Redd

  • Opinions on some things
  • **
  • Posts: 72
  • Gender: Male
  • Forum Member
Re: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre
« Reply #35 on: September 16, 2003, 03:50:38 pm »
I live in Peplins Way and tried enquiring about what amounts to BT Broadband through Plusnet. After trying their web site tester and ringing their customer help line I was told both times that I lived to far away from the Potters Bar exchange for the connection to work. My only hope (Obi-Wan) was to join an experiment being undertaken in extending the 5.5km limit out to 6km with me paying full whack but with no guarantee of success.
 

Offline Alfred the Great

  • Opinions on many things
  • ***
  • Posts: 316
  • Gender: Male
Re: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre
« Reply #36 on: November 15, 2003, 09:26:27 pm »
Don't know if this is the correct thread to ask my question, as follows:

We have just joined up with Tiscali broadband and were supplied (free) with a Sagem USB powered modem, which works fine. The other three PCs in the house access the web via my machine which of course has to be switched on to allow this, via the Belkin 5-port 10/100 switch.

What would be the easiest/best/cheapest way of getting a different modem/router so that any PC could individually access the web without having my machine on? Any suggestions of make/model/suppliers would also be appreciated. Could we also still use the Belkin switch if we wanted to expand beyond 5 ports?

Thanks in advance for your advice.

ATG
Confucius he say "a dog is for life not just for Christmas Dinner"
 

Offline sasquartch

  • Forum Moderator
  • Opinions on everything
  • *****
  • Posts: 1416
  • Thanked: 23 times
  • Brookmans Park Forum Member
Re: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre
« Reply #37 on: November 17, 2003, 01:37:34 pm »
A combined ADSL modem / router would be the best solution, most of these are 4 or 5 port so should be suitable for most home setups.

It will be possible to connect an existing hub or switch to the new modem / router although a cross-over cable may be required unless either hub or switch has a port that can be switched to an 'uplink' port. Most do.

Personally I'd go for a reasonable brand of modem / router such as Netgear although there are loads to choose from

I'd recommend any of the following.

http://www.dabs.com/uk/productView.htm?quicklinx=2J2F

http://www.dabs.com/uk/productView.htm?quicklinx=2137

http://www.dabs.com/uk/productView.htm?quicklinx=ZS7

These are all from dabs.com (excellent service in my experience) but other suppliers are available !

There are cheaper devices available but a little extra spent on a brand name generally means less trouble getting support when things don't work as expected. But it's your choice, I speak as someone involved in network support.

If you need any help feel free to contact me

 

Offline Alfred the Great

  • Opinions on many things
  • ***
  • Posts: 316
  • Gender: Male
Re: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre
« Reply #38 on: November 17, 2003, 11:17:50 pm »
Thanks for your advice and suggestions. I looked at the three units you linked to and they all say "connectivitiy - cable". Would they  work with a normal BT socket like we've got?

ATG
Confucius he say "a dog is for life not just for Christmas Dinner"
 

Offline sasquartch

  • Forum Moderator
  • Opinions on everything
  • *****
  • Posts: 1416
  • Thanked: 23 times
  • Brookmans Park Forum Member
Re: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre
« Reply #39 on: November 18, 2003, 11:57:08 am »
An ADSL modem by definition DOES use a phone line - so these will be suitable.

You are right in thinking that there are 'cable' routers used for people with cable access, these use either a USB or ethernet connection - not ADSL.

Hope that clarifies
 

Offline Editor

  • David Brewer
  • Administrator
  • Opinions on everything
  • *****
  • Posts: 8930
  • Thanked: 144 times
  • Gender: Male
    • Media Helping Media
  • Expertises:
  • Walking
  • Real ale
Re: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre
« Reply #40 on: December 29, 2003, 08:16:35 pm »
Can any of our local IT experts explain whether we will be able to benefit from this development please?  According to the BBC....
Quote
"Rural broadband has been given a boost by the UK Government's decision to free up a key radio frequency...
The decision could help bring high-speed wireless net access to every household in the country."

Click here for the full story
The Brookmans Park Newsletter has been supporting the village and our local community since 1998 by providing free, interactive tools for all to use.
 

Offline sasquartch

  • Forum Moderator
  • Opinions on everything
  • *****
  • Posts: 1416
  • Thanked: 23 times
  • Brookmans Park Forum Member
Re: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre
« Reply #41 on: December 31, 2003, 01:08:06 pm »
As far as I know broadband using ADSL is available to everyone in Brookmans Park now - therefore I don't think there would be any need for wireless services here. Personally I think there is more than enough microwave radiation from mobile phones etc without adding yet another source.
 

Offline Johnny Redd

  • Opinions on some things
  • **
  • Posts: 72
  • Gender: Male
  • Forum Member
Re: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre
« Reply #42 on: December 31, 2003, 05:46:56 pm »
Sorry to burst the collective balloon but I've again checked with the website for Plus.Net and they still tell me that I can't get ADSL at the bottom end of Peplins Way.

I do agree about unnecessary extra radiation though.
« Last Edit: December 31, 2003, 05:49:38 pm by Johnny_Redd »
 

Offline Largey

  • Opinions on many things
  • ***
  • Posts: 102
Re: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre
« Reply #43 on: December 31, 2003, 07:24:36 pm »
Wireless Broadband is destined for those who really are remote. I have read of people in the US who have used it and say that it works very well, better than dial up but they did complain about upload speeds. The technology uses line of sight transmissions. In light of this I don't think that any ISP would be bothered to install masts unless they have enough subscribing members. The cost is also an issue as extra equipment would need to be purchased. Our existing ADSL technology is constantly improving and as has already been mentioned, most of BP should be available soon if not already. I favour a little patience and then everyone should be able to use the RADSL.
 

Offline Editor

  • David Brewer
  • Administrator
  • Opinions on everything
  • *****
  • Posts: 8930
  • Thanked: 144 times
  • Gender: Male
    • Media Helping Media
  • Expertises:
  • Walking
  • Real ale
Re: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre
« Reply #44 on: December 31, 2003, 07:50:20 pm »
Quote
I favour a little patience and then everyone should be able to use the RADSL.

I hadn't heard of RADSL before Paul, but after you mentioned it I looked it up and found a fairly good page describing it. http://www.adslguide.org.uk/qanda.asp?faq=radsl

I tend to agree with the other Paul about the downside of the need for more masts and radiation.

Quote
Personally I think there is more than enough microwave radiation from mobile phones etc without adding yet another source.
The Brookmans Park Newsletter has been supporting the village and our local community since 1998 by providing free, interactive tools for all to use.
 

Offline sasquartch

  • Forum Moderator
  • Opinions on everything
  • *****
  • Posts: 1416
  • Thanked: 23 times
  • Brookmans Park Forum Member
Re: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre
« Reply #45 on: March 12, 2004, 12:14:44 pm »
I've just tried (unsucessfully) to get an ADSL line in Peplins Way

Has anyone got ADSL in Peplins Way, if so which supplier did they use ?

The bt.com website says the property is too far from the exchange although I'm sure I heard that the latest RADSL equipment is now available from the Potters Bar exchange which should increase the range sufficiently.

Any advice welcome !
 

Offline trinity

  • Opinions on many things
  • ***
  • Posts: 150
Re: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre
« Reply #46 on: March 12, 2004, 02:13:34 pm »
Not quite. Nildram do mine to the village end of Oaklands - and there isn't any evidence of service degradation. But I think it is just their service carried over BT lines.
 

Offline Largey

  • Opinions on many things
  • ***
  • Posts: 102
Re: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre
« Reply #47 on: March 12, 2004, 03:36:49 pm »
There is a snippet of info which states that the village should be "Upgraded" within the next 5-6 weeks or so. So it may well be worth the wait.
In respect of nildram, I can highly recommend their service provision. Uninterupted streaming has been tested by us using their service and it passed a lenghty continuous test without a single break. Superlative. Cannot say the same for BT.
 

Offline sasquartch

  • Forum Moderator
  • Opinions on everything
  • *****
  • Posts: 1416
  • Thanked: 23 times
  • Brookmans Park Forum Member
Re: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre
« Reply #48 on: March 12, 2004, 07:27:17 pm »
I'm really after signing up to Plusnet.

They do a 21.99 a month 512kb service with some useful extras eg static IP address and multiple mail accounts.  Several work colleagues have recommended them and always seem to do well in surveys.

Where was the "snippet of info" that suggested an upgrade was coming soon ?

I spoke with BT today who said my line tests out at just over 5km from the exchange, up to 5.5km should be possible. They didn't mention any upcoming upgrades.

The only alternative at present MAY be Bulldog who I think have their own equipment at Potters Bar, therefore bypassing any restrictions imposed by BT.

I've asked Plusnet to have a look to see if anything else can be done.

I'll keep you informed about what happens !

Thanks for the feedback everyone.
 

Offline sasquartch

  • Forum Moderator
  • Opinions on everything
  • *****
  • Posts: 1416
  • Thanked: 23 times
  • Brookmans Park Forum Member
Re: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre
« Reply #49 on: March 15, 2004, 07:21:43 pm »
Latest news :

I cannot get ADSL on my BT line. Unfortunately my line fails the tests and will not support ADSL.
I used the excellent utility at http://www.solo.pipex.net/availability which actually runs the test on the line in real time. I fail with 'insufficient quality'
This is really frustrating as I've checked the numbers of several close neighbours and they all pass the test !
I called BT who flatly refused to look into the problem - as the line functions perfectly with a telephone they don't want to know.
So frustrating !
Was thinking of contacting Ofcom to see if BT have any obligation to look into this but couldn't see anything on their website today.
Any ideas anyone ?

 

Offline trinity

  • Opinions on many things
  • ***
  • Posts: 150
Re: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre
« Reply #50 on: March 15, 2004, 10:58:15 pm »
Quote

Any ideas anyone ?


1. You get the neighbour (who does have a decent line) to get ADSL.
2. You run either 802.11b/g (if they're real close), or a point-to-point microwave link between yours and theirs.
3. You encrypt the link.
4. You run a RADIUS server to swap the shared keys periodically.
5. You only allow the hardware at each end to permit communications with the other end's MAC address.

(Or you use ethernet, again if they're close and anyone in between doesn't mind.)

Or you wait until 802.20 is implemented.

Or BT put in a decent line.

One of the possibilities is that there is something "near" your line (or someone else on the same bearer) that is making noise, that people you know don't suffer. This noise wouldn't necessarily be enough to make the line unusable for conventional voice - or for conventional modem traffic which is designed to work under pretty foul conditions. Obviously, the route the copper actually takes from the exchange to your house isn't a straight line, but if you can show reason to believe that some noise source is causing line quality problems you might have enough of a case to pester them.

Then again, they're up to their eyeballs in broadband demand right now, and doubtless feel that they can afford to **** a few people off.
 

Offline supersonic

  • Opinions on many things
  • ***
  • Posts: 113
  • Yabba-dabba-doo
Re: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre
« Reply #51 on: March 15, 2004, 11:41:47 pm »
Quote
Any ideas anyone ?

sasquartch do you have 'radio' filters on your line?? If so have you considered asking the BT engineers if the special radio interference filters for the BP transmitting station could be affecting their tests?? Maybe you could arrange to get them to re-run the test with the filters unplugged??

supersonic
 

Offline sasquartch

  • Forum Moderator
  • Opinions on everything
  • *****
  • Posts: 1416
  • Thanked: 23 times
  • Brookmans Park Forum Member
Re: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre
« Reply #52 on: March 16, 2004, 11:10:39 am »
Supersonic - I actually tried removing the filter and re-ran the test but it made no difference.

Trinity - I'm looking into using a neighbour's line. Strictly speaking this shouldn't be done as most ISPs prohibit sharing between households. But in practice I don't think anyone will know or even care. Ideally I'll run some CAT-5 between the two properties between my modem at my house and the splitter at the neighbour's house. This way all equipment that needs power will be under my control.

Thanks everyone for the feedback.

 

John_fraser

  • Guest
Re: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre
« Reply #53 on: March 16, 2004, 02:56:17 pm »
The additional length of the cat 5 between the splitter and the modem may still take you over the distance limit. An alternative would be to install a router in your neighbours house and run the cat-5 from that. This would allow your neighbour to also have access to the DSL pipe, at the cost of losing control over the power and access point.

Iíd also recommend that you Ė and your neighbour if applicable - install firewalls to protect your subnet. These are relatively cheap and should protect all of the computers at your house..
 

Offline sasquartch

  • Forum Moderator
  • Opinions on everything
  • *****
  • Posts: 1416
  • Thanked: 23 times
  • Brookmans Park Forum Member
Re: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre
« Reply #54 on: March 16, 2004, 03:36:59 pm »
The extra length (maybe 10-20m) shouldn't be an issue. BT say my line measures about 5.3km so well within the minimum 5.5km limit.

Yes, a firewall will be used. I'm actually going to be using a Wireless modem/router/switch (Netgear DG834G). I've configured several of these at work and they seem pretty secure once everything is locked down.
 

Offline trinity

  • Opinions on many things
  • ***
  • Posts: 150
Re: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre
« Reply #55 on: March 16, 2004, 11:34:18 pm »
Quote
Supersonic - I actually tried removing the filter and re-ran the test but it made no difference.

Trinity - I'm looking into using a neighbour's line. Strictly speaking this shouldn't be done as most ISPs prohibit sharing between households. But in practice I don't think anyone will know or even care. Ideally I'll run some CAT-5 between the two properties between my modem at my house and the splitter at the neighbour's house. This way all equipment that needs power will be under my control.


As John says, that probably won't work because of the additional conductive length of the cable. That the quality of the CAT-5 is far higher than the stuff the phone line is run on won't make a great deal of difference. Apart from anything else, the connectors and so on will provide points at which the ADSL signalling will reflect.

Now, running some ethernet out of the back of a router would be a different matter. Provided the router (or NAT ADSL modem device like the Netgear DG8X4 equipment) presented a single IP interface on the ADSL side, it would be somewhere between difficult and impossible to prove what you were up to. In these things the important rule is the 11th commandment.


Securing the two networks would take a little more care, but if the NAT/ADSL kit's firewall only lets traffic out (i.e. you don't permit any connections in) then all you need is the same sort of thing between the ADSL modem and the two networks.

How far apart are the two houses ?  If they're next door then you almost certainly would get away with 802.11b or even g.
 

John_fraser

  • Guest
Re: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre
« Reply #56 on: March 16, 2004, 11:49:43 pm »
Quote
Securing the two networks would take a little more care, but if the NAT/ADSL kit's firewall only lets traffic out (i.e. you don't permit any connections in) then all you need is the same sort of thing between the ADSL modem and the two networks.
You'd definitly want a firewall - hardware if possible - between your subnet and the router and your neighbour's firewall and the router. Otherwise you are each trusting the other not to let anything nasty into your shared net.
 

Offline trinity

  • Opinions on many things
  • ***
  • Posts: 150
Re: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre
« Reply #57 on: March 17, 2004, 12:49:03 am »
Quote

You'd definitly want a firewall - hardware if possible - between your subnet and the router and your neighbour's firewall and the router. Otherwise you are each trusting the other not to let anything nasty into your shared net.


Exactly, the firewall in the ADSL NAT/modem provides for outgoing but shouldn't let things in. There isn't any need for the ADSL hardware or the NAT in front of eachof the subnets, just the firewall.

The only trouble with this is that low-cost hardware tends to combine ADSL with the wireless and firewall functions - but assumes that everything behind the ADSL is on the same trusted network. Dedicated hardware for things like firewalls is (obviously) available, but it isn't cheap.
 

Offline sasquartch

  • Forum Moderator
  • Opinions on everything
  • *****
  • Posts: 1416
  • Thanked: 23 times
  • Brookmans Park Forum Member
Re: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre
« Reply #58 on: March 17, 2004, 11:21:07 am »
Trinity - don't know what you mean by 'the additional conductive length of the cable' in this case.
What I'm proposing to do is run a single cable between the splitter and the ADSL modem. There won't be any more joins and even though this cable could be 10-20m long that's not much compared with the 5300 metres (and probably quite a few joins) between me and the exchange. So I don't anticipate a problem, but then you never know.
Firewalling will be handled by the Netgear DG834G. I'll configure this to allow nothing in (no need for any DMZ) and probably not much out (by default nothing outbound is blocked). I don't need to give my neighbour any access so there's no requirement to subnet the LAN and firewall between subnets. Wireless will be set up to use WPA 128-bit, the SSID will be obscure and not broadcast. Clients will be locked down by MAC address. This should deter all but the most determined hacker, if anyone really wants to hack in then they will but can't imagine they would be bothered.
I've still got to see if my neighbour is willing, but if so I'm going to give it a go.
It still wouldn't suprise me if BT refuse to provide a connection for some obscure reason even though Demon say it's available.
We'll see !
I'll keep you updated on progress - and thanks for the feedback everyone.
 

John_fraser

  • Guest
Re: Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre
« Reply #59 on: March 17, 2004, 02:06:55 pm »
Quote
Dedicated hardware for things like firewalls is (obviously) available, but it isn't cheap.

Not as dear as you might expect. My employer put a dedicated FW in at a cost of £200. This also provides me with a Linux development box, so it is very over speced. Pick up an old PC, too old to run XP on and hence cheep, install two lan cards, download a copy of Linux and you could set one up for about almost nothing.
 

Tags: