Village broadband and high-speed optic fibre

[Johnny Redd]

Just wondering if anybody has experienced a dropoff of broadband service in the last week or so?

Here at the far end of Peplins Way, we only just get half a meg on a good day and it has become apparent in the past that the 'reception' is so poor that only a very few wireless routers will work with the signal strength. Whenever the slightest reduction is experienced we have to switch to a Voyager 105 ADSL modem and lose our wireless network, all very frustrating. To top it all BT aren't interested as their meters show a constant half meg strength.

Therefore the enquiry is 2 fold. Has anybody experienced a dropoff (caused maybe by lots of people being at home over the holdays) and does anybody have any techie knowledge that would back up my thoughts re wireless routers and their minimum signal strength requirements???

Many thanks.

[Editor]

Just wondering if anybody has experienced a dropoff of broadband service in the last week or so?

Hi Johnny,  yes, mine has slowed down a bit from an average of 2.8 mbps to 1.8 mb (depending on the time of day), so I guess it might be down to people being at home and using their connections. I am at the village end of Moffats.

I find this speedtest site to be the best for testing the speed.

David

[sasquartch]

The speed of your internet connection is nothing to do with whether your router is wireless or not. Most wireless routers work using the 802.11g standard which is 54Mbps, this has no relationship to the ADSL speed of 'up to 8Mb'.

I'm in Peplins too and have noticed my speed has dropped off a bit to approx 1.8Mbps, it has been around 2.5Mbps in the past  but this does vary. I use a Netgear DG834G and have found these to be very good once the firmware is updated to the latest version. I have had problems with newer non-standard routers, especially those which claim to be conforming to the new 'N' standard. Most of the time these are a waste of time if all you do is surfing the web.

It seems that you are just on the edge of being able to get a satisfactory connection and that your USB modem is just slightly better than your wireless router.

It could be worth doing some of the checks described earlier in the thread.

Unfortunately in Peplins we are about the furthest from the exchange that you can get in BP, also the street is wired using aluminium cable (common when the houses were built in the 1950s) which is not as good as copper.

[Johnny Redd]

Thanks sasquartch,

You can see from previous posts in the thread that this problem first reared its head back in March. Back then I established (and was indeed told by BT) that the signal strength made a difference to the 'make' of router you could choose. They actually said that the voyager modem was the only method of establishing a contact with a weak ADSL signal although I have proved that I can use a Belkin 54g most of the time.

I unsuccessfully tried 2 different routers back then (including another Belkin loaned by David) so I'm interested in whether a router configured to 8.0211g would work with a signal of less than 54mbps?? I'm currently getting 476mbps using David's recommended speedtest as above.

Regards.
 

[sasquartch]

I'm interested in whether a router configured to 8.0211g would work with a signal of less than 54mbps?? I'm currently getting 476mbps using David's recommended speedtest as above.

Just to confirm, the wireless link speed has nothing to do with the ADSL side of things.

A speed test result of 476k (not 476m !) is not great but is it always this speed ? When I originally had ADSL I was on a (then) standard 512k service. A year or so ago I changed to a 'up to 8M' service which meant the modem would connect at the highest speed possible in the prevailing conditiond. Have you checked with your ISP that you are definitely on an 'up to 8M' service ? It is not unknown for configurations to be mistakenly changed or corrupted. I would suggest making a call even if just to eliminate the possibility you have been incorrectly downgraded.

Presumably you have checked performance with the router plugged directly into the BT socket, ie with the cover removed ?

Unfortunately I don't have a spare router at the moment to lend you (I do have a Netgear on loan) .

Does your existing router report attenuation and noise margins ? If so it would be intersting to see the results. For interest, my Netgear router reports the following :

Connection Speed 1824 kbps 448 kbps
Line Attenuation 53 db 15.5 db
Noise Margin 11 db 16 db

[Editor]

I unsuccessfully tried 2 different routers back then (including another Belkin loaned by David) so I'm interested in whether a router configured to 8.0211g would work with a signal of less than 54mbps?? I'm currently getting 476mbps using David's recommended speedtest as above.
 

Hi Johnny,

I have another router you can try. It's the latest D-Link. Very good.

David

[Johnny Redd]

Thanks David, I might take you up on this once i've tried Sasquartch's recomendations.

But........just so I know i'm explaining this correctly,

-I understand the 'ADSL' to be the broadband signal coming down the phoneline
-the router receiving this signal fails to register it is receiving a signal at all when it falls below a certain value....so far unknown but not much less than half meg
-the 'wireless' side of things continues to work but obviously doesn't connect to anything as it can't talk to the outside world.
-a change of router fails to solve the problem but the use of the voyager ADSL modem does.

Therefore, is the above generally problem known about in the IT world??? or is this forever to be known as the Peplins phenomena???

and thinking back, I checked the line using all available resources (master socket/BT visit etc) back in March and it is definately the case that a "Half Meg" signal is present but the routers don't register it (using their 192.168.X.X diagnostic page)

Thanks again.
 

[Alex]

 

As far as I am aware the speed is also dictated by the BT line and it's distance from the main centre - which in our case is Potters Bar. The nearer the centre the more speed you get.

Some time ago I was not getting acceptable speed and after long dicussions and investigations conducted by BT, my internet supplier and my computer support  it was decided that this was the main cause.

I am getting more acceptable speeds now, but I guess that might be that I'm used to this!

I understand that when we had the problems with the phones in the latter part of (now) last year, that some cables were replaced and that the customers on this new line are getting faster speed on computer- and less noise on their phones.

[fredw]

I am using a very old D-Link DSL-504 ADSL router and get download speeds of 2Mb and upload speeds of 400Kb as my norm.

I am in Bradmore Way, my BT line is from the telegraph pole immediately to the south of the Primary School.

My neighbour, whose line is from the next pole along , going from Bradmore Green, is only getting 0.5Mb download, not sure of his upload speed.

It does look as though distance is important as we are close to the limits for ADSL.

[sasquartch]

It is not just the distance from the exchange but also the quality of the line. I believe that everyone in Brookmans Park should be able to get speeds of more than 512kbps as the distance limit for ADSL has been increased several times to somewhere in the region of 10km.

It may be that your neighbour's service is actually set at 512k and it is not the line. My Plusnet service was originally 512k and I had to specifically request that this was changed to an 'up-to-8Mb' service as I opted out of the blanket upgrade when it was introduced. he should contact his ISP to check this.

Possibly your neighbour's internal phone wiring is causing problems. Possibly his modem is at fault, it is always worth trying another if possible. It's always worth upgrading the firmware too if possible. Some modems will report line stats such as attenuation and signal to noise ratio, these can be a guide as to whether the line quality is an issue.

I am in Peplins and get around 1.5Mbps, a 2Mbps service in Bradmore would seem about as good as it gets.

[Dem]

Hi guys!

After about 3 years of trying to sell our previous house in Barnet, we've finally been able to make the move into Brookmans Park, and now live in Uplands Drive.

After the usual debacle with Sky ("can't find your dish" etc.), we finally had the tv running properly and in theory (after a 15 day wait!) broadband.  Had AOL for many years and then Pipex in the old house, running wireless on a Netgear router with no problems at all.

Once the Sky kit arrived and I had confirmation that broadband was running, I plugged everything in and all seemed well when using the LAN cable.  However, as the phone point is downstairs and nowhere near the desktop PC, I need all PC's here to run wirelessly, including the desktop (with a wireless card).

Signal strength is very strong on the PCs (above 80%).  However, the connection drops right out to 0% intermittently.  The frequency of drop out varies from day to day. Sometimes, it will run for 30 minutes before dropping then automatically reconnecting, but sometimes it will drop out every minute, automatically reconnecting each time.  Given that when running, the signal strength is always upwards of 80%, I don't think it's the relative positions of router and PCs.  My biggest fear is the radio antenna across the road and whether that is causing the intermittent problem?

Don't know if it's related, but also bought new Digisenders to transmit Sky from downstairs to a bedroom, and this has terrible interference on it, no matter where I position the transmitter / receiver.  Had a similar set-up in the previous house with no issues.

Any help / information appreciated before I waste my time with Sky 'help' again!

Thanks!

Dem.
 

[sasquartch]

Dem

Interference is a possibility but in all probability it wont be the transmitting station.

My first suggestion would be to ensure your router is updated with the latest firmware and secondly to try a different wireless channel.

If you need help with this let me know via IM, I can usually resolve most wireless problems.

[Ferdie]

I have never got to the bottom of a problem in Calder Avenue, whenever I use my laptop off the mains, the mouse pointer seems to have a mind of its own, 'dancing' all over the screen, making it vitually impossible to operate. The laptop is fine everywhere else. Also, many years ago, when some speaker leads were routed through a wall from one room to another, a CD player refused to play any further than about track 4 or 5. It was fine when these other speakers were disconnected and or placed elsewhere. The house also used to receive the radio through the phones! So clearly there are issues in BP with something.

[awill]

I live at the very top of Peplins Way (so about as far from the PB exchange as you can be in the village) and the Broadband is painfully slow. Interestingly the speed I am getting is what the BT website suggests I will get. If I plug my phone number into the BT broadband speed checker below it says I should expect 0.5mb so sadly it does exactly what it says on the tin.....sob sob.

http://www.productsandservices.bt.com/consumerProducts/displayTopic.do?topicId=16738

Has anyone tried this service - BT Broadband Accelerator - no prices listed but they offer a no fee guarantee if they don't increase your speed by 0.5mb. Would be interesting to see how that works if the most I can get is 0.5mb! Guessing they will only do this for people who are supposed to get 8mb.....

http://bt.custhelp.com/cgi-bin/bt.cfg/php/enduser/cci/bt_catpage.php?p_sid=sSxy6H6j&cat_lvl1=346&cat_lvl2=1282&cat_lvl3=1859&p_cv=3.1859&p_cats=346,1282,1859

[sasquartch]

I have never got to the bottom of a problem in Calder Avenue, whenever I use my laptop off the mains, the mouse pointer seems to have a mind of its own, 'dancing' all over the screen, making it vitually impossible to operate. The laptop is fine everywhere else. Also, many years ago, when some speaker leads were routed through a wall from one room to another, a CD player refused to play any further than about track 4 or 5. It was fine when these other speakers were disconnected and or placed elsewhere. The house also used to receive the radio through the phones! So clearly there are issues in BP with something.

Problems like this can be caused by large induced signals from the AM transmitters at Bell Bar. The answer will probably lie in using ferrite beads - these are not the small beads you can buy in Maplins and the like which are suitable for VHF (100Mhz range) interference, but much larger heavier rings that are effective at frequencies around 1MHz. I had problems with AM radio being audible on my phone line, some ferrite rings supplied by the transmitting station cured the problem completely. I would recommend calling in at the office (entrance on A1000) and reporting the problem, in my experience the operators (National Grid Wireless) are really helpful and will freely offer help and advice.

[pgmills]

Has anyone tried this service - BT Broadband Accelerator - no prices listed but they offer a no fee guarantee if they don't increase your speed by 0.5mb. Would be interesting to see how that works if the most I can get is 0.5mb! Guessing they will only do this for people who are supposed to get 8mb.....

If you contact BT broadband and complain about the speed and mention the transmitter station they will eventually send a technician who will fit the bit of kit for free! It should then get you to 1mb at least.


edited only to correct quote link.Bobm

[Dem]

Dem

Interference is a possibility but in all probability it wont be the transmitting station.

My first suggestion would be to ensure your router is updated with the latest firmware and secondly to try a different wireless channel.

If you need help with this let me know via IM, I can usually resolve most wireless problems.

Hi and thanks for the offer of help.   Pleased that it probably isn't the transmitting station!

Router seems to have the latest firmware, but I will double check.

I did try a few different channels at random, but all seemed to drop out at some point.  Sky 'e-mail' help have asked me to go through them in turn which I'm now doing.  Up to number 5 so far................

Will keep you posted!

Interestingly, my PS3 seemed to hold the connection without dropping, when the PC next to it would drop out every few seconds........ 

[Editor]

Router seems to have the latest firmware, but I will double check.

Hi Dem,

I can lend you a D-Link wirless router and give you some filters if you want to have a play around with an alternative system. Just send me a personal message and we can make arrangements.

David

[sasquartch]

Interestingly, my PS3 seemed to hold the connection without dropping, when the PC next to it would drop out every few seconds........ 

Have you tried another laptop / PC ? - if the PS3 stays up it might indicate a problem with the wireless setup at the computer end rather than the router. Would definitely suggest borrowing a wireless laptop from someone to test this, even if just to eliminate it as a possibility.

[Dem]

Hi Dem,

I can lend you a D-Link wirless router and give you some filters if you want to have a play around with an alternative system. Just send me a personal message and we can make arrangements.

David

Thanks David - will send PM!


 Note: Edited only to fix quote box.

[Dem]

Have you tried another laptop / PC ? - if the PS3 stays up it might indicate a problem with the wireless setup at the computer end rather than the router. Would definitely suggest borrowing a wireless laptop from someone to test this, even if just to eliminate it as a possibility.

Hi!

Yeah, tried with 3 PC's.  Have 2 laptops and a desktop (running a wireless card) and all 3 have the same problem.  Interestingly, having 2 side by side, you can see one drop the signal, but the other maintain it and vica-versa.  Also, the desktop is next to the PS3 and you can see that lose connection, but the PS3 doesn't indicate that it has (maybe it can hide / buffer it better?).

Gonna swap my Sky Sagem Router with my sister's over the weekend just to eliminate that piece of hardware from the equation!

Cheers,

Dem.
 

Note: Edited only to fix quote box.

[barnabus]

I dont know if this is of any help - but I had a computer problem today - intemittently (but pretty frequently) getting an 'unable to show webpage' and the diagnoistics saying there was nothing wrong wth my connection.

Tried everything to no avail - reboot, clean disk, restore, rang ISP helpline, etc etc .

Then tried on our older computer upstairs - same problem.

Tried another single modem rather than the router (a netgear 834v3) - internet now all OK.

So updated the firmware from the Netgear site for the router and remarkably all back  to normal and surfing to my hearts content.

But what a frustrating day!

Barnabus

[Bob Horrocks]

I have been having the same problem as Barnabus.  I suspect the internet is very busy at the time and there must be some time limit which kicks in to bring up that message.   Does anyone who really knows have the answer?

[sasquartch]

I have been having the same problem as Barnabus.  I suspect the internet is very busy at the time and there must be some time limit which kicks in to bring up that message.   Does anyone who really knows have the answer?

Bob

The message 'Page cannot be displayed' simply means that your web browser (IE, Firefox or whatever) has not received a response from the web server.

This can be caused by a number of things, your PC may not be connected to your router (eg Wireless connection not operational), your router may not have a connection to your ISP, your ISP may have a problem or the webserver itself may not be responding amongst other things.

The internet is not one 'thing' but a large number of interconnected networks so it is not really true to say it is busy as such. The bit of the internet you are using (ie your ISP's network) may be busy, also there may well be contention for bandwidth as ADSL is a shared service (as is cable btw) between you and other users. Most ISPs use the BT broadband infrastructure.

I and others have posted many suggestions about what to check in this thread. If you are still having problems feel free to IM me.

[barnabus]

I mentioned to our computer expert at work that I needeed to reinstall the firmware on my router and he was very surprised as he had not come across it before as a problem.

Another thing I learnt on Saturday is that as I bank with First Drect they have a computer section who are willing to give advice over the phone  and they were a great help in tracking down the problem - perhaps first direct are just diversifying into something else as there is no money in banking any more!

KR

Barnabus

[Dem]

Hi guys,

Just to let you know.  My router worked fine at my sister's house, so seemed not to be a router problem.  Brought her's back with me anyway, rigged it up downstairs and started testing performance on each of the 13 channels using my desktop upstairs (wireless).  All pretty bad, some worse than others, but channel 12 seems to be about the best.  I left it on channel 12 and the next day, connected downstairs (wireless) and it held with no problems.  It's been fine ever since!  I haven't checked on the desktop upstairs again, but guess that even if that one does drop out occassionally, it must be because it is too far away from the router.

So, hopefully it's all fixed and hope that anyone else with a similar problem in the area (with Sky BB) has some success using Channel 12 on their router!

Cheers,

Dem.
 

[Editor]

According to the BBC, Britain's biggest broadband supplier has been accused of limiting download speeds on its cheapest package without giving users a clear warning.

BT Broadband cuts the speed users can watch video services like the BBC iPlayer and YouTube at peak times. A customer who has signed up for an up to 8 megabit per second package can have their speed cut to below 1Mbps. A BT spokesman said the firm managed bandwidth "in order to optimise the experience for all customers".

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/8077839.stm

[Editor]

Has anyone else been experiencing broadband problems last night and today?  I am with BT and my ethernet link to the router and my wireless link keep dropping.  

David

[Mermaid]

My Zen broadband is OK.

[Editor]

Mine is now fixed. Talked to a really helpful guy in India who put the wireless on another channel and changed a few other settings. Working really well now. We had a nice chat, too. He asked if I had been to India and I said I had lived there for some time. Turns out I lived in his town, Jamshedpur. He was delighted. Very impressed with the remote support.