Author Topic: Housing, planning, and development in North Mymms (Read 638267 times)

RuralFox · « **Reply #1380 on:** March 11, 2016, 08:09:33 pm »

epiphany,

Brookmans Park is only in the green belt because it is part of the Metropolitan Green Belt around London. Other green belt areas are Manchester, Liverpool, Birmingham, Newcastle, Oxford, Cambridge, York etc. The common theme here is that the green belt acts as a collar around these cities to restrict them from expanding into the countryside. Green belt purposes also restrict neighbouring towns within that ring of green belt from merging with each other (Welwyn Garden City, Hatfield, St. Albans etc).

With the exception of “encroachment into the countryside” it would be hard to argue that any of the other green belt purposes that you list would be harmed by “a few hundred houses around Brookmans Park” when weighed against the housing need in the borough. Furthermore, “encroachment into the countryside" (which is essentially a landscape assessment) would be a valid consideration for any planning authority, whether or not the land to be developed was in the green belt. Your blanket approach that green field sites (of which there are none in the borough) are more suitable for development than green belt sites is therefore too simplistic. The greatest need for new homes is in the areas around the cities, so development in the green belt is a much wider national issue. Are you suggesting that Welwyn Hatfield Borough and all other Counties within the green belt (around London, Manchester, Birmingham etc) should all be exempt from meeting their need for new homes, or just Brookmans Park?

epiphany · « **Reply #1381 on:** March 11, 2016, 09:28:43 pm »

Ruralfox.

Correct, the Green Belt prevents neighbouring towns from merging together. This is achieved by having bits of Green Belt between them. If you build on the bits of Green Belt they are not Green Belt anymore

Hatfield is currently separated from Potters Bar by bits of Green Belt. Since the Metropolitan Green Belt was created, South Hatfield and Welham Green have moved inextricably closer together, almost within touching distance. So we are left with the bits of Green between Welham Green and Brookmans Park and Brookmans Park and Potters Bar. Potters Bar is curently undertaking its own Local Plan and will also have to expand. Recently a Solar Farm adjoining the north of Potters Bar has been granted planning permission which will stretch to the RVC playing fields in Hawkshead Lane. So, yes the bits of Green Belt that are now left are incredibly important in preventing neighbouring towns merging together. A few hundred houses around Welham Green, A few hundred houses around Brookmans Park, A few hundred houses around Little Heath. Where do YOU draw the line. Do you wait until there is no Green Belt left, or do you build on some more and just leave a tiny bit?
Remember, many of the various Green Belt sites around this area have had development proposals before. They have all been successfully rejected, sometimes by a judge. It is only because of the Green Belt and the concerted efforts of previous generations to protect it that we are having this discussion now, otherwise Brookmans Park would have been part of London long ago.

In a previous post you commented how successful the Green Belt was between Mill Hill and Borehamwood. It would not be quite so successful if it had houses on it, would it?

By the way, Panshanger is a green field site.

trekbat · « **Reply #1382 on:** March 12, 2016, 11:00:02 am »

Quote from: epiphany on March 10, 2016, 11:28:01 pm

Welwyn Hatfield Council has not stated that it needs to build at least 10,000 homes - the figure is actually higher, between 12,616 and 13,433.

The simple truth is that we don't know how many homes we need given the various influxes - like EU migrants and refugees (both of which are potentially unlimited by treaty).

The situation with voluntary EU migration is further complicated as we could embark on an expensive house and associated infrastructure building programme (on the Green Belt and brownfield sites) only for there to be a drastic fall in Sterling for some reason (as there was when the Northern Rock crisis triggered a run) and many EU nationals will wake up to the fact that they can earn more in the Eurozone and be closer to their home countries to boot, and upsticks and leave (us with the bill).

IanHardy · « **Reply #1383 on:** March 24, 2016, 07:25:02 am »

Hello -I've registered as a Little Heath resident in Hertsmere following the Little Heath Action Group's item in the latest "Potters Bar Community News" about WH's proposed housing development just north of Little Heath. However, the Group's website as mentioned therein doesn't seem to be working (and googling doesn't help), so I'm using this suggested alternative. How do I join the Group please to keep tabs on the housing development and voice my objection whenever the consultation period dates are announced?

Note I have an interest beyond the personal - I am on the PPG Committee of the Annandale Medical Centre in Potters Bar (on the High Street), and the Centre is already stretched to the limit (whilst still providing a first class service to its patients! - as recognised in the recent National GP survey).

Thanks, Ian Hardy (ian dot hardy at btinternet dot com)

Editted to amend email address only

motherchuck · « **Reply #1384 on:** March 24, 2016, 09:46:28 am »

It was good to hear from Jed Griffiths, the planning consultant advising the North Mymms Green Belt Society, that in his opinion following meetings with the WHC, there would not be any new housing development on the field at the junction of Bradmore Lane and Station Road, the far side of the bridge by the railway station.

He was speaking at the AGM of the NMGBS in the church on Monday evening.

This site might have had up to 380 houses on it and the traffic from it would have caused the most awful
problems for the residents of Water End - a proposed Conservation Area - and as Jed Griffiths said, Water End already has terrible flood issues without the possible water run off from a field covered in concrete.

epiphany · « **Reply #1385 on:** March 24, 2016, 02:50:52 pm »

Motherchuck,

I was also at the NMDGBS AGM on 21 March and heard what Jed Griffiths said. My interpretation of what was ACTUALLY said is as follows:

1) Whilst speaking about the principles of planning in the Green Belt, Mr Griffiths stated (as an example) that in his opinion he "would be very surprised if BrP4 were included in the Final Draft of the Local Plan". He did not state that this observation was following meetings with WHBC. Indeed it is important to note that at the present time, WHBC have not yet made their decisions on which sites to recommend to take forward for allocation in the Local Plan. As Jed Griffiths also pointed out, we are extremely unlikely to hear about these sites until shortly before the Public Consultation in the Summer (June/July).

2) It is also important to note that although BrP4 has the potential to exacerbate flooding at Water End, ALL the sites around Welham Green, Brookmans Park and Potters Bar have the potential to exacerbate flooding at Water End because they ALL ultimately drain into the Mimmshall Brook - see map below. Jed Griffiths made this very point about the cumulative flood risk of the various sites to Water End.

<a href="http://www.brookmans.com/pdfs/Appendix_B_FINAL_Watercourses_South.pdf" target="_blank">http://www.brookmans.com/pdfs/Appendix_B_FINAL_Watercourses_South.pdf</a>

Note: Edited to embed pdf.

motherchuck · « **Reply #1386 on:** March 25, 2016, 02:52:32 pm »

epiphany,

It is good to know people are scrutinising the very peculiar site selection process of WHC and ACTUALLY taking minutes at meetings, however I think you will find that Jed Griffiths said 'BrP4 will never happen,' and as his meetings with WHC were before he made his comment at the NMDGBS meeting then his observation was following meetings with WHC.

It appears you are well aware of the flood risk to Water End and so are WHC who stated in their Housing Background Paper Part 2 Distribution Options September 2012 prepared by the Council's own planning officers in respect of BrP4: "THE AREA TO THE WEST OF THE RAILWAY LINE IS NOT CONSIDERED SUITABLE TO TAKE FORWARD AS A VILLAGE EXTENSION.(BrP4)"

However by October 2014 it was, for reasons unknown, slipped into the mix as 'Finely Balanced.' ? ? ?

Another totally unsuitable site that the WHC have designated as 'Finely Balanced' is WGC5.

This is an old landfill site that Tarmac are promoting as Birchall Garden Village for over two thousand new homes. I am sure most people are aware of the health risks of living next to a landfill site but maybe not
the WHC. An inquest is scheduled for June into the death of 7yr old Zane Gbangbola who lived next to a landfill site at Chertsey,Surrey. His parents have spent two years compiling a mountain of evidence which they say proves their son was killed by hydrogen cyanide gas seeping into their home from contaminated
floodwater coming from a former landfill site near their house. The father is now in a wheelchair.

For more information: http://truthaboutzane.com/updates

For more on toxic landfill sites and birth defects: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/146634.stm

To stop this madness before Brp4 and WGC5 are put forward in the Local Plan in July contact your
local councillors.

Editor · « **Reply #1387 on:** March 25, 2016, 03:23:52 pm »

Quote from: motherchuck on March 25, 2016, 02:52:32 pm

To stop this madness before Brp4 and WGC5 are put forward in the Local Plan in July contact your
local councillors.

Motherchuck, would you say that all the proposed sites in Brookmans Park would have an adverse impact on the possible flooding in the area, or are there some sites that have been proposed that would have no impact whatsoever?
David

epiphany · « **Reply #1388 on:** March 25, 2016, 04:44:21 pm »

The Housing Background Paper Part 2 Distribution Options September 2012 is an interesting document that discusses BrP4, BrP6, BrP9 & BrP10 on pages 35 & 36 (see below).

BrP4 was actually not considered suitable because of the following: "The area to the west would be separated from the rest of the village by the railway and only accessible via a narrow road over a bridge on a tight bend. The landscape in this area has been assessed as having medium to high sensitivity to change and low capacity to accommodate new development. Development to the west of the railway line would result in urban encroachment into the countryside and have a significant impact on openness. Development on this scale would represent major growth, disproportionate to the size of the existing village"

motherchuck · « **Reply #1389 on:** April 03, 2016, 11:09:00 am »

David

There are two sources of water flowing to Water End and the Swallow Holes, which is a unique Site of Special Scientific Interest (SSSI). Firstly, there is the normal river flow along the Raybrook (to the south of Brookmans Park) and the Mimmshall Brook (to the south of Welham Green). The water flows from east to west. Both of these brooks are classed as rivers in Flood Zone 3 by the Environment Agency. Secondly, there is surface water (rainwater) which flows from the land into the Raybrook and into Mimmshall Brook at times of heavy rain. It is heavy rainfall (surface water) entering the two rivers which causes flash flooding in Water End.

The closer the site is to Water End the greater and the faster the impact of surface water flooding. BrP4, to the west of the East Coast Mainline Railway, is inundated with surface water during the winter months and, due to the underlying clay, heavy rain flows directly into the Raybrook, causing flooding.

Sites to the east of the ECML will not cause direct flooding in Water End because (1) the elevated railway embankment acts as a physical barrier (attenuation) and (2) there is a greater opportunity for ground absorption and evaporation due to distance.

Time, distance and attenuation to the water flow are all crucial to reducing flooding. In York, following the dreadful floods this winter, the farmers are now building “leaky dams” along the route of the rivers towards the City. These are some distance upstream from York City Centre and they have the effect of attenuating the flow of water towards the City at times of heavy rain. By slowing the flow, the river will be able to cope better with the more local rainwater and reduce the likelihood of flooding in the City.

http://www.york.ac.uk/research/themes/river-floods/

So, BrP4 to the west of the railway line will cause a greater risk flooding in Water End.

leader · « **Reply #1390 on:** April 13, 2016, 01:14:09 pm »

Hi

Just to remind everyone that the North Mymms Parish Council Annual Meeting is due to take place on Tuesday 19th April at Little Heath Parish hall at 7.30pm

leader · « **Reply #1391 on:** April 14, 2016, 10:08:37 am »

Good Morning

The next Council Planning meeting is as below

It starts at 7.30 and includes a section and paper from Colin Haigh on the problems surrounding the current Local Plan key issues.

It suggests some ways forward which have implications

I suggest you read the paper below as for once the paper is fairly short!

[size=78%]21/04/2016 7:30pmCypress Room[/size]
Salvation House2 Sterling CourtMundellsWelwyn Garden CityAL7 1FT Agenda and Reports [552KB]

leader · « **Reply #1392 on:** April 26, 2016, 01:14:23 pm »

As a result of the CHPP meeting we will be working with the North Mymms District Green Belt Society on the issues raised.

We believe that urgent action is required before the publication of the revised Local plan

leader · « **Reply #1393 on:** May 25, 2016, 12:36:49 pm »

Next Council planning meetings Local plan

The dates are 13/ 15 /and 30th of June in the run up to the publication of the revised Local Plan. More details nearer the time

leader · « **Reply #1394 on:** June 02, 2016, 07:43:25 am »

Oliver Dowden MP drawing attention to the issues linked to the proposed developments of the Welwyn Hatfield Councils Local Plan around Brookmans Park and Little Heath. This supports our submission in the Consultation period last year

He has also raised this in the House of Commons

<a href="http://www.brookmans.com/pdfs/wht%201%20jun%2016.pdf" target="_blank">http://www.brookmans.com/pdfs/wht%201%20jun%2016.pdf</a>

leader · « **Reply #1395 on:** June 07, 2016, 09:17:14 am »

Here is the document to be discussed at the next CHPP meeting on Monday at the Council offices

It identifies the final sites being recommended

leader · « **Reply #1396 on:** June 07, 2016, 09:19:54 am »

Little Heath has two main sites being proposed totalling 135 new dwellings

We shall hear what is said at the first meeting on 13th next week

leader · « **Reply #1397 on:** June 14, 2016, 09:05:38 am »

I attended the meeting last night where the Local plan was discussed by the Council.

The Council agreed to take forward the outline plan which has been published (on their website).There was much concern about the high numbers of houses required and the effects on the infrastructure around the area!

Residents will have the opportunity to make their comments in the new Consultation period which is expected to run from the end of August to the end of October.

You can keep up to date with issues and information by joining our group. Its Free - Just send your email address and house number and postcode to

littleheathactiongroup@aol.co.uk

Thanks

leader · « **Reply #1398 on:** July 04, 2016, 06:01:14 am »

The next meeting of the planning committee will be on Thursday 14th July

More details will be issued nearer the time

leader · « **Reply #1399 on:** July 07, 2016, 07:43:08 am »

Good Morning

The CHPP meeting on 14th July will not discuss the Local plan. The following meeting is scheduled now to review the plan.

We will publish details nearer the time

Editor · « **Reply #1400 on:** July 12, 2016, 04:57:18 pm »

The latest Local Plan Newsletter has been sent out by Welwyn Hatfield Council. (I am posting this in both the Brookmans Park and Little Heath Local Plan threads for those who have asked for notifications of updates.)

<a href="http://www.brookmans.com/pdfs/Local%20Plan%20Newsletter%2010%20July%202016%20FINAL.pdf" target="_blank">http://www.brookmans.com/pdfs/Local%20Plan%20Newsletter%2010%20July%202016%20FINAL.pdf</a>

Editor · « **Reply #1401 on:** July 12, 2016, 04:57:43 pm »

The latest Local Plan Newsletter has been sent out by Welwyn Hatfield Council. (I am posting this in both the Brookmans Park and Little Heath Local Plan threads for those who have asked for notifications of updates.)

<a href="http://www.brookmans.com/pdfs/Local%20Plan%20Newsletter%2010%20July%202016%20FINAL.pdf" target="_blank">http://www.brookmans.com/pdfs/Local%20Plan%20Newsletter%2010%20July%202016%20FINAL.pdf</a>

leader · « **Reply #1402 on:** July 14, 2016, 07:08:16 am »

The documents for the revised Local Plan are now available on the Councils website.

These are very large documents some of which are hundreds of pages . They will be discussed at the Council meeting on Wednesday 20th July at 7.30pm

Residents should go the the Councils website under " Meetings and agendas" to read the large documents.

We recommend residents attend this meeting to hear the final Councils views before its finally agreed and sent out to residents for the Consultation period from the end of August to October

Editor · « **Reply #1403 on:** July 14, 2016, 07:18:27 am »

Here is the link to save everyone searching.

Agenda

leader · « **Reply #1404 on:** July 28, 2016, 10:49:36 am »

The next CHPP meeting is on 11th August

This is the final meeting before the launch of the new Local Plan which will now be open for Consultation by residents from 30 August for 8 weeks

We will publish more details nearer the time.

We are working with a number of groups to review how we should help and advise our members and will let you know in due course what these plans are

leader · « **Reply #1405 on:** August 03, 2016, 01:44:45 pm »

Here are some letters from residents re the Local plan issues in todays W H Times.

leader · « **Reply #1406 on:** August 09, 2016, 08:51:42 am »

The Councils CHPP meeting this Thursday will not contain any specific items for the Local plan on the agenda

Further details for the Consultation period which starts at the end of August will be published in due course

Editor · « **Reply #1407 on:** August 10, 2016, 07:18:51 am »

The council has just circulated what has been described as a "Local Plan Consultation Special" newsletter for August, embedded below. It includes the consultation timetable with a number of dates which people might like to copy to their diaries. The meeting for this area is to be held on Tuesday 6 September at the URC on Bluebridge Road between 15.30 and 19.30. I am copying this to both local plan threads because people may have notifications turned on for the specific threads.

<a href="http://www.brookmans.com/pdfs/Local%20Plan%20Newsletter%2011%20August%20consultation%20special.pdf" target="_blank">http://www.brookmans.com/pdfs/Local%20Plan%20Newsletter%2011%20August%20consultation%20special.pdf</a>

Editor · « **Reply #1408 on:** August 10, 2016, 07:23:16 am »

The council has just circulated what has been described as a "Local Plan Consultation Special" newsletter for August, embedded below. It includes the consultation timetable with a number of dates which people might like to copy to their diaries. The meeting for this area is to be held on Tuesday 6 September at the URC on Bluebridge Road between 15.30 and 19.30. I am copying this to both local plan threads because people may have notifications turned on for the specific threads.

<a href="http://www.brookmans.com/pdfs/Local%20Plan%20Newsletter%2011%20August%20consultation%20special.pdf" target="_blank">http://www.brookmans.com/pdfs/Local%20Plan%20Newsletter%2011%20August%20consultation%20special.pdf</a>

epiphany · « **Reply #1409 on:** August 10, 2016, 09:30:56 am »

For those of you who may have lost their way in the complicated Local Plan process, I have detailed below the sites in North Mymms that are in the Local Plan document referred to in the Council leaflet above.

Please note that just to confuse things the Council have now changed the site identities. Below are listed both old and new prefixes.

WELHAM GREEN
WeG4b/SDS 7 Marshmoor - 80 dwellings and 40,500m2 of employment land (Industrial units for Life Sciences)
GTLAA01/HS35 Foxes Lane Gipsy Site - 12 additional pitches
Hat11/HS11 Land at Southway (next to New Barnfield) - 120 dwellings

BROOKMANS PARK
BrP4/HS22 Land west of Brookmans Park (next to Bradmore Lane) - 250 dwellings
BrP13/HS21 West of Golf Club Road - 14 dwellings
BrP14/HS 23 East of Golf Club Road - 10 dwellings

LITTLE HEATH
BrP7/HS24 Hawkshead Road - 100 dwellings
LHe1/HS25 Land north of Hawkshead Road - 35 dwellings

The above sites are the only North Mymms sites now included in the Local Plan.

HOWEVER:

All the Welham Green sites are considered suitable but have not been put forward because of limited Primary School capacity and because an alternative site has not been identified to deliver an expanded school.
Two of the site promotors are currently working together and are in discussion with the Council to address this issue and it is possible that following this Public Consultation the Council could decide to make changes and additions and re-consult before submitting the Plan to an Inspector for Public Examination.

Similarly in Brookmans Park development has been capped to approx 250 dwellings because of limited capacity to expand the Primary School. Once again the site promotors of sites that are considered suitable are seeking to resolve this issue with the Council.

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Author Topic: Housing, planning, and development in North Mymms (Read 638267 times)