Author Topic: Garden Waste Collection Charge  (Read 26293 times)

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Offline Cathy

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Re: Garden Waste Collection Charge
« Reply #30 on: November 15, 2016, 08:16:01 am »
Please be aware that the idea, that Welwyn Hatfield is out of line with other councils because it does not charge for garden waste is untrue.
In Hertfordshire there is not a single  district that charges for garden waste collection without also collecting food waste separately.
There are 10 districts in Hertfordshire.
4 have moved to separate collection of  garden waste and food, using extra little bins for a weekly food collection.
2 of the 4 are charging for garden waste (Three Rivers and Broxbourne)
2 of the 4 collect both garden waste and food free (St Albans and Dacorum)
The other 6 still collect garden waste and food waste together. (Welwyn Hatfield, East Herts, North Herts, Stevenage, Watford and Hertsmere).
 
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Offline Editor

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Re: Garden Waste Collection Charge
« Reply #31 on: November 15, 2016, 08:32:16 am »
I was chatting to a friend in the pub over the weekend, and he suggested that one consequence of this could be that more people turn to garden bonfires as a way of disposing of previously recyclable waste. That would be a pity, and not great for the environment.
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Offline trekbat

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Re: Garden Waste Collection Charge
« Reply #32 on: November 16, 2016, 04:03:46 pm »
I suspect many will choose the easier option and there'll just be more fly-tipping.


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The consultation also includes printed forms with second class prepaid envelopes available at libraries.


I could have picked up and filled in ten of them - if I had been so minded (but didn't give in to the temptation and so refrained from wasting any more taxpayers' money. Whether everyone else did the same I couldn't say).

 

Offline epiphany

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Offline Cathy

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Re: Garden Waste Collection Charge
« Reply #34 on: November 22, 2016, 10:21:54 am »
 Welwyn Hatfield Council are now admitting that if they introduce paid garden waste collection, residents will have to put food waste in their black bin. The council are now sending out (expensive) cards to tell residents this.
The WHBC survey closes on Monday Nov 28th. The survey does not give any opportunity to say "continue as now" or to comment on the problem of food waste, or other problems of paid garden waste collection.
The alternative survey , with more options and a comment box, has now re-opened,  so if you haven't answered it yet, please do so.
https://www.surveymonkey.co.uk/r/WHGardenAlt
Also , please send comments to contact-whc@welhat.gov.uk
and direct to john.dean@welhat.gov.uk and helen.bromley@welhat.gov.uk
It was clear from last night's meeting of WHBC Council that the problem of food waste had been ignored when WHBC first sent out their survey.
Please let them know that you do not want to put food waste in your black residual waste bin.
1. This food waste will go to landfill or to incineration, whereas it could be treated to make compost (in-vessel composting) , or to make better compost and power (anaerobic digestion).
2. Food waste in landfill causes dangerous methane
3. Food waste going to landfill or incineration is expensive financially and environmentally damaging.
3. WHBC and "Waste Aware" and the Herts Waste Partnership have been urging residents for years to put food waste in brown bins,  not in black bins. If they charge for garden waste collection, they will be urging you to do something that they know is environmentally and financially bad.
4. Herts County Council disposes of the waste, and HCC gives financial rewards to boroughs if the boroughs have less residual waste and more recycling. So WHBC would not gain these rewards if they create more residual waste in black bins.
5. In any case, the costs of HCC for disposal , and of WHBC for collection of waste, are all paid for by the council-tax payer.
6. Black bins in Welwyn Hatfield are already over-flowing. Already too many people put food waste in the black bins. We need no food waste to go in them. Ideally we need separate weekly collection of food waste, but collection of food and garden waste together is the next best option.
7. Pretty well everyone has some food waste, even if they try hard not to be wasteful. Food waste that can be recycled includes tea-bags, egg-shells, and vegetable and fruit peelings.
8. The only two districts in Herts that are charging or are about to charge for collection of garden waste collect food separately.(Three Rivers and Broxbourne). This is quite different from what WHBC is plannning.
   
« Last Edit: November 23, 2016, 09:51:05 am by Bob »
 
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Offline Aloo

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Re: Garden Waste Collection Charge
« Reply #35 on: November 23, 2016, 07:58:43 am »
This consultation maybe contrary to WHBC own policy on consultation and engagement.  The wording of the consultation makes it appear that a decision to charge has already been made.  The courts have a set of rules on whether an exercise is lawful caleld the  "Gunning Principles".   
These include whether the Council had an "open mind" or whether the decision had been pre-determined.  Argubly the cards that the council will be issuing on food waste, indicate pre-determination.
The second principle is about consultees being given sufficient information to allow intelligent consideration.  Not sure that the information we have been given so far allows any form of intelligent consideration!


someone in the council needs to look at the legality of this "consultation". 





 

Offline Cathy

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Re: Garden Waste Collection Charge
« Reply #36 on: November 23, 2016, 08:51:46 am »
Sorry for the slip in the email addresses of Helen Bromley and John Dean
The end of each address should be gov.uk
 

Offline Bob

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Re: Garden Waste Collection Charge
« Reply #37 on: November 23, 2016, 09:51:58 am »
Sorry for the slip in the email addresses of Helen Bromley and John Dean
The end of each address should be gov.uk
Is that better, I've corrected them for you.
Bob
 

Offline Helen

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Re: Garden Waste Collection Charge
« Reply #38 on: November 23, 2016, 09:29:03 pm »
I emailed the Council yesterday with my concerns. Today I received a standard FAQ Sheet. Needless to say, it fails to address my concerns in any great detail.


I've attached it below.


By the way, I just tried clicking on the latest Survey Monkey link but it appears not to be working again.
 

Offline trekbat

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Re: Garden Waste Collection Charge
« Reply #39 on: November 25, 2016, 01:43:16 pm »

Article on the subject in the WHT:

Attempts to ditch bin charge plans rejected by Welwyn Hatfield Council
http://www.whtimes.co.uk/news/attempts_to_ditch_bin_charge_plans_rejected_by_welwyn_hatfield_council_1_4792239

 

Offline epiphany

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Re: Garden Waste Collection Charge
« Reply #40 on: November 25, 2016, 08:11:37 pm »
This nice, expensive, thick colour card was delivered today from the bumbling and not very environmentally friendly Conservative led Welwyn Hatfield Borough Council.


It is an enormous shame that WHBC did not go to the same lengths to publicise their recent (or any of the previous) Local Plan Consultation.


My answers to the questions below:


1) Although not all residents use the garden waste service, many residents do not have children at school, use the library or even benefit from street lighting.
     It would be an administrative nightmare to personalize each individual Council Tax bill, it would also be open to abuse so the fairest way is to have one bill that encompasses ALL services.


2) John Dean, the leader of the Council states that he would not support an annual fee greater than £35 pa. This does beg the question: If it has already been decided, why are we having a consultation?


3) Food waste to be put in black (landfill) refuse bin. This absolutely flies in the face of all that we have been encouraged to do, and will undermine in one fell swoop, years of education and behaviour pattern changes to the detriment of the environment and increased land fill tax bills for the council.
 
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Offline Editor

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Re: Garden Waste Collection Charge
« Reply #41 on: November 26, 2016, 10:16:41 am »
3) Food waste to be put in black (landfill) refuse bin. This absolutely flies in the face of all that we have been encouraged to do, and will undermine in one fell swoop, years of education and behaviour pattern changes to the detriment of the environment and increased land fill tax bills for the council.

Do you think they are making this up as they go along? Seems like the ramblings of the confused rather than a thought through strategy.
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Offline Nimbus

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Re: Garden Waste Collection Charge
« Reply #42 on: November 26, 2016, 05:28:56 pm »
Do you think they are making this up as they go along? Seems like the ramblings of the confused rather than a thought through strategy.
Definitely! It is clear that they haven't costed a separate food waste collection, which they would have to subtract from the 'savings' from the changes to garden waste collection, in order to establish the overall 'benefit'.
 

Offline Helen

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Re: Garden Waste Collection Charge
« Reply #43 on: November 26, 2016, 05:49:06 pm »
I'm wondering too if WHBC has thought about how they would monitor whether the brown bins put out for collection belong to the households who have decided to pay for the service. I can't believe they'd want the cost of a timely exercise by the bin collection team checking each bin is 'paid up' before they empty it each time. Therefore, they'd either have to simply collect every brown bin put out or issue yet another new different coloured bin to those residents opting to pay...
 

Offline Ex Libris

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Re: Garden Waste Collection Charge
« Reply #44 on: November 26, 2016, 07:05:33 pm »
Good point Helen.  Let's hope, what ever WHBC decides to do, they don't have to spend £3.5m doing it - http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/midlands-news/birmingham-garden-tax-boss-admits-8459136

 
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Offline memsal9

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Re: Garden Waste Collection Charge
« Reply #45 on: November 28, 2016, 11:00:22 am »
I was chatting to a friend in the pub over the weekend, and he suggested that one consequence of this could be that more people turn to garden bonfires as a way of disposing of previously recyclable waste. That would be a pity, and not great for the environment.

Me thinks you may be right. Last week the neighbor was burning laurel leaves. Went on for the whole day, you couldn't leave windows open or go out into the garden.
 

Offline trekbat

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Re: Garden Waste Collection Charge
« Reply #46 on: November 28, 2016, 02:36:27 pm »

From the WHT


Furious residents rally against bin charge plans outside Welwyn Hatfield Council’s offices
http://www.whtimes.co.uk/news/furious_residents_rally_against_bin_charge_plans_outside_welwyn_hatfield_council_s_offices_1_4794795

 

Offline trekbat

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Re: Garden Waste Collection Charge
« Reply #47 on: November 28, 2016, 02:41:27 pm »
Anyone planning on burning their waste may be well advised to read WHBC's guidance on the issue:



Bonfires and smoke
"Bonfires are not an acceptable method of disposing of domestic garden rubbish or commercial trade waste."
http://www.welhat.gov.uk/neighbourhood/bonfires?sendtoid=252&formid=69919


[Includes a PDF on domestic bonfires, which states: "Bonfires can cause real annoyance and nuisance to neighbours and we strongly discourage them. "]
http://www.welhat.gov.uk/CHttpHandler.ashx?id=1481&p=0
 

Offline Red-Point

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Re: Garden Waste Collection Charge
« Reply #48 on: November 29, 2016, 01:49:14 am »
The builders working on the corner of Mymms Drive / Calder Ave seem to be enjoying a daily bonfire.
 

Offline memsal9

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Re: Garden Waste Collection Charge
« Reply #49 on: November 29, 2016, 09:13:01 am »
Anyone planning on burning their waste may be well advised to read WHBC's guidance on the issue:



Bonfires and smoke
"Bonfires are not an acceptable method of disposing of domestic garden rubbish or commercial trade waste."
http://www.welhat.gov.uk/neighbourhood/bonfires?sendtoid=252&formid=69919


[Includes a PDF on domestic bonfires, which states: "Bonfires can cause real annoyance and nuisance to neighbours and we strongly discourage them. "]
http://www.welhat.gov.uk/CHttpHandler.ashx?id=1481&p=0

Then I guess the Council will have to find extra money to fund the army of inspectors to respond to the growing numbers of complaints. Every action leads to a reaction.
 

Offline trekbat

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Re: Garden Waste Collection Charge
« Reply #50 on: November 30, 2016, 11:17:24 am »

Yes, it seemed an impractical idea from the off.


That said, it is a democratically elected - and accountable - council (that the majority of voters in BP helped elect) going about its lawful business.
 

Offline trekbat

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Re: Garden Waste Collection Charge
« Reply #51 on: December 02, 2016, 02:35:12 pm »
According to this week's WHT (p13) the leaflet 'From the Leader' that John Dean has had sent out about the  Garden Waste Collection Charge cost £8,000 to distribute and £1,048 to produce ie. a total of £9,048 (or the first year's income from the proposed charge from 258 households, assuming a rate of £35).
 
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Offline Cathy

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Re: Garden Waste Collection Charge
« Reply #52 on: December 16, 2016, 07:11:14 pm »
 
PLEASE HELP STOP WELWYN HATFIELD COUNCIL
CHARGING FOR COLLECTION OF BROWN WASTE BINS
& FORCING RESIDENTS TO PUT FOOD WASTE IN BLACK BINS

You can help persuade Welwyn Hatfield Borough Council not to reverse the gains that have been made in recent years in our borough in the composting of food waste and of garden waste.

If charges are made for collection of brown bins, the Council is not legally allowed to tell residents to put food waste in those bins. The council will have to totally reverse what they have rightly been encouraging residents to do, and will have to tell us to put food waste in the black bins, the contents of which are sent to landfill or incineration. This will apply to all residents, not just those who decide they don’t want to pay for brown bin collection.

Charging for brown bins is also extremely likely to lead to some people wasting their useful garden waste, and causing pollution and mess, by putting it in their black bins, or burning it on bonfires, or fly-tipping it.

1. PLEASE SIGN THE PETITION:
https://www.change.org/p/welwyn-hatfield-borough-council-no-to-the-welwyn-hatfield-bin-tax

This petition has been organised by WHBC councillor Max Holloway.

2. PLEASE HELP COLLECT SIGNATURES
1. Send the petition on to your friends and neighbours
2. Come to help collect signatures:
a. Hatfield.                  Sat Jan 7. 10.30 - 4.30 White Lion Square
b. Welwyn Garden City. Sat Jan 7. 10.30 – 4.30 Howard Centre

3. PLEASE COME TO
THE SPECIAL MEETING OF WELWYN HATFIELD COUNCIL 
MONDAY JAN 9. 7.30. Campus East Council Chamber.
Please come early, bringing your own banners and placards.
WHBC leaders have called this meeting “to consider the recommendations”.

 
 

Offline epiphany

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Re: Garden Waste Collection Charge
« Reply #53 on: December 22, 2016, 11:59:52 am »
The report for the WHBC meetings on Monday 09 January of the Special Cabinet meeting at 6.30pm closely followed by the Special Council meeting at 7.30pm has now been uploaded to the WHBC website (see below).


Recommendations are:


  • Cabinet recommends to the Council to approve a one-off capital budget of £100,000, required for implementation of changes to the waste collection system and that this is added to the 2016/17 capital programme.
  • Cabinet recommends to the Council to set a charge for the garden waste collection service of £35 for the first bin per property per annum and £60 for the second bin per property per annum, commencing in the new financial year 2017/2018. 
  • The Cabinet agrees the following collection policies and operational procedures in connection with this garden waste collection service:
  • a) Those who do not join the chargeable garden waste collection service will not have their garden waste collected 
  • b) Those who join the chargeable garden waste collection service will not be able to present kitchen food waste in this bin 
  • c) Black refuse bins will not be collected if garden waste is presented in this bin
  • d) Food waste may temporarily be re-directed to the black refuse bin, until such time as an alternative collection and treatment solution can be found 


<a href="http://democracy.welhat.gov.uk/documents/g496/Public%20reports%20pack%2009th-Jan-2017%2018.30%20Cabinet.pdf?T=10" target="_blank">http://democracy.welhat.gov.uk/documents/g496/Public%20reports%20pack%2009th-Jan-2017%2018.30%20Cabinet.pdf?T=10</a>
 

Offline Beppy

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Re: Garden Waste Collection Charge
« Reply #54 on: December 22, 2016, 12:35:22 pm »
Just got around to reading Autumn 2016 edition of Herts CC Horizon mag. On the inside of the front cover is a full page by WasteAware Hertfordshire Partnership extolling the virtues of recycling food waste: "If every household in Hertfordshire recycled just ONE tea bag per week we could divert over 350 tonnes from disposal each year, saving at least £20,000 of council taxpayers money!"  Food for thought - apologies for the pun.
Perhaps Welwyn Hatfield Council don't receive the Horizons magazine!!
 

Offline epiphany

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Re: Garden Waste Collection Charge
« Reply #55 on: December 22, 2016, 12:44:16 pm »
The above report does not contain the following:


  • Current income from sale of compost
  • Estimate of loss of compost income following implementation of collection charge
  • Estimate of increase in land fill tax if food waste is included in black bins.



 

Offline trekbat

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Re: Garden Waste Collection Charge
« Reply #56 on: January 06, 2017, 01:07:25 pm »

Welwyn Hatfield brown bin collection fee public questions stifled
http://www.whtimes.co.uk/news/welwyn_hatfield_brown_bin_collection_fee_public_questions_stifled_1_4839414




It's staggering how much time and effort must be being taken up across the country over dealing with waste (how to get rid of it, flytipping, environmental impact...). Incinerators have been proposed - and usually fought against, with differing levels of success.


The plastic bag tax has made a massive impact on the number used, and there are other private initiatives (like the Too Good to Go app) that can drastically reduce the amounts that would otherwise end up in bins. It's a pity the Government isn't taking a far more proactive stance on the subject.


This app lets you buy unsold food that restaurants would have wasted
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/2016/08/08/too-good-to-go-app-lets-you-buy-unsold-food-that-restaurants-wou/
 

Offline trekbat

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Re: Garden Waste Collection Charge
« Reply #57 on: January 09, 2017, 04:37:58 pm »
Brown bins D-Day for Welwyn Hatfield Council
http://www.whtimes.co.uk/news/brown_bins_d_day_for_welwyn_hatfield_council_1_4841168

Given John Dean's track record on dealing with dissenters (and in fairness to those that have previously - the apparent lack of appreciation by voters) it seems to be pretty much a foregone conclusion with the only thing to be seen is whether councillors stick to their party lines.

 
Correction - Apologies, the meetings are going  ahead in the new chamber
 

Offline trekbat

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Re: Garden Waste Collection Charge
« Reply #58 on: January 09, 2017, 06:52:53 pm »
Passed by the first meeting.
Some 27 seats for the public in the new chamber, with an overflow  / reception with a similar capacity. Televised but not streamed.
 
 

Offline trekbat

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Re: Garden Waste Collection Charge
« Reply #59 on: January 09, 2017, 08:34:03 pm »
Passed 28 for, 18 against.
If opposition comments accurate, then a Council tax rise is also in the pipeline.
 
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