Author Topic: Hawkshead Road Car Boot Sale Field  (Read 142606 times)

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Offline sasquartch

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Re: 20 acre field
« Reply #150 on: July 14, 2007, 02:16:27 pm »
That's good news !!!

Thank you to Bob for his efforts which benefit us all in BP.
 

Offline James Bentall

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Re: 20 acre field
« Reply #151 on: July 14, 2007, 02:56:17 pm »
Seconded - thank you to everyone for their work in ensuring that the green belt remains as it is...

James
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Offline Peter Hastings

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Re: 20 acre field
« Reply #152 on: July 14, 2007, 03:06:27 pm »
Yes well done the Inspector- the bits of the appeal I heard left me thinking this was a tough decision to make and I certainly wouldnt have wanted to call the outcome.


Well done to you Bob and your colleagues at the Green Belt Society.

No doubt this decision will also be quoted round the country particularly as the pressure on the green belt grows.
 

Offline Mermaid

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Re: 20 acre field
« Reply #153 on: July 14, 2007, 03:29:38 pm »

That's brilliant news! Well done indeed Bob, to you and your team.

Let's hope that decision sends out a signal to those who would develop the Green Belt for their own gain - that existing communities who would be affected by the development deserve to have their views taken into account.

Happily, it seems money can't buy everything!



 

Offline Editor

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Re: 20 acre field
« Reply #154 on: July 14, 2007, 07:11:30 pm »
Bob popped a copy of the full appeal decision through my letter box this evening, so I have scanned it and put it on the site for anyone interested in reading it.

Click here for the Friday Grove appeal decision.
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Offline Bob Horrocks

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Re: 20 acre field
« Reply #155 on: July 15, 2007, 05:37:43 pm »
The local opposition was a team effort.  Claire Taylor spoke as chairman of the NM Green Belt Soc, and Bernard Spatz on behalf of Gobions Woodland Trust.  I spoke on behalf of the parish council.  Also my thanks to Dave for putting a copy of the Inspector's report on this site, and his encouragement over the years.

The community spirit in and around Brookmans Park is very evident and I wish to record my thanks to everyone who contacts me to ensure that the parish council and Green Belt Soc are aware of potential and actual developments.

It will be more than interesting to see what happens now.  A lot of money was spent on the two planning applications and the appeal.  In addition the purchase price paid was well in excess of the agricultural value.

Offline ADM

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Re: 20 acre field
« Reply #156 on: July 16, 2007, 10:23:52 am »
I don't want to go all Churchillian on you, but well done 'the few'.  And you're right, this probably isn't the end, but it is the end of the beginning.  We shall fight them on the beaches etc...
 

Offline Mallow

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Re: 20 acre field
« Reply #157 on: July 16, 2007, 01:06:58 pm »
"8. I consider that the building would not blend in with its wider surroundings but rather would stand out as something alien and discordant"

Above is a quote from the the seven page report.

Would this be the same authority, that sanctioned the carbuncle or an extension to the Comet Hotel ???
Life is not about waiting for the storm to pass, it's about learning to dance in the rain!
 

Offline Bob Horrocks

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Re: 20 acre field
« Reply #158 on: July 20, 2007, 05:05:37 pm »
It was the Planning Inspectorate that decided on Friday Grove.  I am afraid I do not know who approved the Comet Hotel application.  Could Mallow please advise if it was Welwyn Hatfield Council or an appeal where that decision was made?

Offline Mermaid

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Re: 20 acre field
« Reply #159 on: September 28, 2007, 05:01:04 pm »
Is this land now up for sale? Spotted a 'Land for Auction' notice as I drove by there just now .......
 

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Re: 20 acre field
« Reply #160 on: September 30, 2007, 01:26:43 pm »
Is this land now up for sale? Spotted a 'Land for Auction' notice as I drove by there just now .......

Hi Mermaid,

Yes, it is up for auction next month as a ‘freehold site with development potential (subject to necessary consents).'   The price is put at £900,000+.

Click here for more details.
« Last Edit: September 30, 2007, 09:05:52 pm by David Brewer »
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Offline Mermaid

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Re: 20 acre field
« Reply #161 on: October 01, 2007, 06:11:48 pm »
I notice that nowhere in the description does it say that this is green belt agricultural land.

Are auctioneers not bound by the same 'accuracy' rules as estate agents?  >:(
 

Offline Bob Horrocks

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Re: 20 acre field
« Reply #162 on: October 02, 2007, 10:43:29 am »
Another local Green Belt site was auctioned a year or so ago and I made the mistake of giving my email address to the auctioneer in order to see the details in the catalogue.  The details omitted to mention the Green Belt location and the NM Green Belt Soc asked for this to be stated at the auction.  Memory fails me and I cannot recall if this was done.  The land was sold but I do not know at what price etc.

Be warned - I cannot persuade the company to remove my email address from their circulation list.  It costs them nothing to email me, but it is very annoying for me.

Offline Mermaid

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Re: 20 acre field
« Reply #163 on: October 02, 2007, 04:59:45 pm »
Having spoken to The National Association of Estate Agents (of which Drivers and Norris is a member) I can now answer my own question - yes there is a requirement for them to be accurate in the details of  land - as well as property - which they offer for sale. The fact that this land is Green Belt should be mentioned in the details.

Has anyone registered to receive the full sales pack? I have a catalogue on pdf downloaded from their website which does not mention the fact that the land is Green Belt and I'd like to know if it's mentioned elsewhere at all.
 

Offline Bob Horrocks

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Re: 20 acre field
« Reply #164 on: October 03, 2007, 11:45:12 am »
NM Green Belt Soc has contacted the auctioneer, copy to the Nat. Assoc of Estate Agents and Welwyn Hatfield Council.  The Soc has pointed out the apparent non-compliance with the Estate Agents Code, and asked that the limitations on development of Green Belt land are drawn to the attention of potential bidders.

Offline Mermaid

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Re: 20 acre field
« Reply #165 on: October 03, 2007, 12:15:06 pm »
That's good news Bob, let's hope that the auctioneers comply.

At a guide price of £900,000, any bidders will only be interested in development potential! I can't see it being bought by a philanthropist for the local community to continue to enjoy being surrounded by green fields!!
 

Offline Bob

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Re: 20 acre field
« Reply #166 on: October 03, 2007, 12:42:29 pm »
Large advert in the property section of today's WHT. No mention of green belt  ::)
Bob
 

Offline Mermaid

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Re: 20 acre field
« Reply #167 on: October 04, 2007, 09:56:50 am »

Surely it's misleading not to include in the advertisements the fact that the land is green belt?

All property details that estate agents publish in the public domain should be as accurate as possible. In my view, it is quite wrong to leave out of the advertisements and on their website, such an important detail as the land being green belt!



 

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Re: 20 acre field
« Reply #168 on: October 04, 2007, 12:23:01 pm »
The local green belt society has called on the agents behind the auction of Friday Grove to make it clear in the sale details that the site is green belt land. The North Mymms District Green Belt Society (NMDGBS) fears the omission of the fact in the published details could mislead prospective purchasers.

The agents behind the auction of the site, Drivers & Norris, say they do not consider it important to declare on their website that the site is green belt land. A representative of Drivers & Norris said the information was contained in their legal pack and they didn’t consider it misleading to omit it from the publicity for the auction.

Click here for more details...
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Offline speedwell

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Re: 20 acre field
« Reply #169 on: October 04, 2007, 05:35:21 pm »
does anybody know how much it was purchased for by the current owner?  Surely by omitting 'greenbelt' from the description this could mean somebody else buying it and trying for a development???  Also if greenbelt is missing surely this could affect the price paid
 

Offline peppermint

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Re: 20 acre field
« Reply #170 on: October 04, 2007, 09:39:22 pm »
I phoned the agents today and asked was the land on green belt.   They said they were not aware that it was on green belt land.
I told them that it was and that perhaps they should make it clear in their advertising as the way it is being advertised, referring to shops, schools, mainline station, etc., would suggest that the land is being advertised for sale as a development site for homes.

I was told they will pass my comments on (to who I dont know).
 

Offline James Bentall

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Re: 20 acre field
« Reply #171 on: October 04, 2007, 10:15:44 pm »
I would have thought that any property developer who is willing to spent the best part of £1m buying a field would check first with the authorities to see whether land can be built on or not first and not just rely on the estate agent's description of the land (which, with all due respect to Neville and friends can be viewed through rose tinted glasses at times....)

James
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Offline Neville Hobbs

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Re: 20 acre field
« Reply #172 on: October 05, 2007, 07:52:08 am »
Thanks James.  Agent details must portray the property accurately but we dont have to state negative points eg. within close earshot of noisey trains and a pub. Those points will be apparant to viewers.

I seem to remember that Neil Bedford paid about £180,000 for Friday Grove. I think that the guide price of £900,000 is hilarious! As James states, no-one is going to bid for a parcel of potential building land without checking its planning history and zoning first. When Mr Bedfors bought the land, he also paid for what we call "hope value" that possibly one day the land can be developed. Now he has had a planning application refused especially at appeal level, there is no hope value at all. I will watch the auction result with interest.

Neville
 

Offline sasquartch

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Re: 20 acre field
« Reply #173 on: October 05, 2007, 09:21:14 am »
I think agricultural land has a value of around £5000/acre I seem to recall reading somewhere (perhaps Neville could confirm ??) , therefore it's real value must be in the region of £100,000 for 21 acres.

I think there could still be 'hope' value, if a change in government policy results in land use being reviewed. Also I believe that as agricultural land you could run a business, perhaps stables or a riding school or something like that which in an area like BP may be profitable even if the land is purchased at well above agricultural rates.

It will be interesting to see what happens.
 

Offline Bob Horrocks

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Re: 20 acre field
« Reply #174 on: October 07, 2007, 11:32:36 am »
The Land Registry entry shows the price paid was £150,000 in 2002.

The RVC put in an offer at that time believed to be £90,000, which ties in with Sasquartch's figure.

Even Property Spy or 'travellers' would be unlikely to be interested because of the £900,000+ price tag. 

We do have the East of England Plan hanging over our heads with the Government proposing 15,000 homes in Welwyn Hatfield between 2001 and 2031.   The final figure may be known in the next few months.  In view of the current state of the housing market......

Who said life is dull.

Offline speedwell

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Re: 20 acre field
« Reply #175 on: October 07, 2007, 12:47:54 pm »
500% increase in price in 5 years , now thats what I call a return!  Will he have to pay capital gains tax on that?
what a pity the vet college didn't get it for grazing etc back in 2002.  Think of the money its cost the local council to make and uphold the decision about planning.

Sadly there just might be somebody out there prepared to buy it at the hughly inflated price hoping to sell it to the govt for another hughly inflated price as part of the east of england plan and low and behold suddenly planning permission would be granted.
 

Offline Neville Hobbs

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Re: 20 acre field
« Reply #176 on: October 10, 2007, 05:57:17 am »
"500% increase in price in 5 years , now thats what I call a return! " 

Don't get too excited speedwell, it hasn't  sold yet! The guide price was probably given to D & N by the vendor as often happens. It would be interesting to know what D & N valued the land at.

The Auction brochure states: N.B. Please note that these are not quoting prices but are an indication of the lowest price which may be acceptable, and they are liable to change at any time.

Auction date is 16th October and it is LOT 13 !

Neville
« Last Edit: October 10, 2007, 06:11:17 am by Neville Hobbs »
 

Offline speedwell

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Re: 20 acre field
« Reply #177 on: October 10, 2007, 08:17:44 pm »
wasn't assuming he would get the £900k, however, if you work on the basis that is what he is looking for then it does work out at that stupid figure.

Personally, hope nobody bids on it once they realise that it is greenbelt land with refused planning permission at appeal stage but if anybody does bid on it hope its not enough so he is stuck with a plot of land and then I'm sure the auction house would still charge????

Maybe just  maybe he'll want to off load it to the vet college for a reasonable sum.

what is the average increase around here for the last five years?
 

Offline JLC

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Re: 20 acre field
« Reply #178 on: October 16, 2007, 04:32:57 pm »
Anyone know the outcome of the auction?
 

Offline Bob Horrocks

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Re: 20 acre field
« Reply #179 on: October 17, 2007, 10:35:37 am »
I am told that the auctioneer clearly stated that the site is in the Green Belt but that the government's requirements for more housing meant that there was development potential.

He then asked for bids starting at £750,000 with no bidders.  He then tried to start bidding at £650,000 and again there were no bids so this LOT 13 was withdrawn.

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