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Career advice for seven-year-olds
« on: October 26, 2009, 08:52:32 am »
According to the BBC...

Quote
Children as young as seven are to be offered careers guidance under a government scheme in England.

The programme, which aims to broaden the horizons and raise the aspirations of children from deprived backgrounds, is to be piloted in seven local areas.

Universities and firms will give pupils a glimpse of what it is like working and learning in adulthood, as part of a broader new careers strategy.

Under the scheme, careers advice will continue up to the age of 18.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/8322627.stm

I suppose it's good to have an idea of what you want to do early on, but I didn't figure it what I wanted to do (or what I could do) until my late teens - and then it took several years of travelling abroad to make sense of it.

David
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Offline PS

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Re: Career advice for seven-year-olds
« Reply #1 on: October 26, 2009, 09:08:23 am »
David - agreed. I was into my early / mid twenties before I decided - and only after qualifying as a teacher [but not actually took it up] before going into finance. And only then it was after bumming around North America for 2 years with hair almost down to down to my waist !!! And I'm a geezer !!!

No - it is a little too early and where is the childhood these days.
 

LongTallSally

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Re: Career advice for seven-year-olds
« Reply #2 on: October 26, 2009, 10:06:19 am »
Does this have anything to do with NASA?

When my boys were seven there was only one career....being an astronaut!

Agree with you on this...far too early. Don't think they have any idea what a career really is at that age.
 

Offline James Bentall

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Re: Career advice for seven-year-olds
« Reply #3 on: October 26, 2009, 10:29:16 am »
Think I'll be the voice of dissent here. If this was to happen in Brookmans Park, I would agree, far too early. The vast majority of children who live in the village have older siblings and/or adults in the home who are in steady employment or motivated to be looking for work. Contrast this with areas of severe poverty where a single plarent family will be surviving on benefits, older siblings and/or parents may be living at home but not in any sort of employment or education - I don't see anything wrong with talking to young children and pointing out there are alternative ways of living and helping them and motivating them to see that. It's not so much offering them different career choices as pointing out that one choice IS to have a career, which will be a completely alien concept to a lot of these kids.

James
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I post in a personal capacity and not on behalf of North Mymms Parish Council
 

Offline PS

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Re: Career advice for seven-year-olds
« Reply #4 on: October 26, 2009, 11:17:05 am »
James - I would tend to agree with you to some extent concerning children in severe poverty areas, where Mothers, et al are "surviving" on benefits. I am sure that in a lot of cases this is indeed true. However, in a great deal more cases, benefits are often supplemented by the proverbial 2 / 3 days per week - "cash-in-hand" - jobs which often means that the overall salary is greater than what can be earned doing a proper career role.

Thus when the parents have their 50 ins plasma tvs with Sky subsribed sports on all day, supplemented by a diet of extra strong lager under a cloud of tobacco smoke [and worse], then its easy to see why kids decided to go down the route their parents have taken.

And usually its the parents who continually tell their kids "...it ain't worf workin' for nuffin, innit..." that's the problem. Unfortunately, an odd hour or two of "career advice" given out to children by the Govt is not really going to help.

   
 

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Re: Career advice for seven-year-olds
« Reply #5 on: October 26, 2009, 11:35:49 am »

Contrast this with areas of severe poverty where a single plarent family will be surviving on benefits, older siblings and/or parents may be living at home but not in any sort of employment or education - I don't see anything wrong with talking to young children and pointing out there are alternative ways of living and helping them and motivating them to see that.


Totally agree, James, there will be cases where this may be extremely valuable.


However, in a great deal more cases, benefits are often supplemented by the proverbial 2 / 3 days per week - "cash-in-hand" - jobs which often means that the overall salary is greater than what can be earned doing a proper career role.

Thus when the parents have their 50 ins plasma tvs with Sky subsribed sports on all day, supplemented by a diet of extra strong lager under a cloud of tobacco smoke [and worse], then its easy to see why kids decided to go down the route their parents have taken.

And usually its the parents who continually tell their kids "...it ain't worf workin' for nuffin, innit..." that's the problem. Unfortunately, an odd hour or two of "career advice" given out to children by the Govt is not really going to help.
   

PS, some massive generalisations here. You don't have much faith in those who may need a bit of a leg up, do you.

David
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Offline PS

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Re: Career advice for seven-year-olds
« Reply #6 on: October 26, 2009, 11:41:45 am »
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PS, some massive generalisations here. You don't have much faith in those who may need a bit of a leg up, do you.


On the contrary, I certainly do for the genuine - but not for those who don't want to help themselves. Unfortunately, its yet another problem that has been allowed to fester by successive govts. Result ? Generation after generation of "career benefit fraudsters".
 

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Re: Career advice for seven-year-olds
« Reply #7 on: October 26, 2009, 11:45:34 am »
But the thread is about career advice for seven-year-olds. It would be good to keep it on topic rather than divert it towards a discussion about various social stereotypes - that could lead anywhere.
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Offline PS

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Re: Career advice for seven-year-olds
« Reply #8 on: October 26, 2009, 11:59:23 am »
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But the thread is about career advice for seven-year-olds. It would be good to keep it on topic rather than divert it towards a discussion about various social stereotypes - that could lead anywhere.

OK then - so any ideas anyone on how we can overcome the "career advice" given to children from becoming benefit claimants to captains of industry ?

Here's one - perhaps we can have regular daily hourly "career" lessons at schools for the seven year old children ? At the same time, evening classes could be held for parents reminding them of their responsibility to re-enforce this message to their seven year olds during the bedtime story !!

Its needs two to tango otherwise it likely to fail.
 

Offline Bob Horrocks

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Re: Career advice for seven-year-olds
« Reply #9 on: October 26, 2009, 12:58:20 pm »
You have to feel sorry for kids today.

A recent report suggested school should start at 6.  The Government has a curriculum from nappy stage to when kids start at school.  Sex education at primary school.  A huge fear of child molesters, with a checking system which will only reveal previous convictions plus rumours of possible supicious behaviour.  And now careers advice at primary school.  A rebellious school kid managing to get a teacher with 32 years experience convicted because the teacher tried to exercise control over the kid.  Parents failing to acknowledge that their little darlings are little devils.     

These are just a few examples of life today.  OK, there are many more sensible, well disciplined kids, but I am so glad I was born when I was and educated before 'trendies' ruined the education system.

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Re: Career advice for seven-year-olds
« Reply #10 on: October 26, 2009, 01:50:41 pm »
Come on Bob, granted you are a fine product of a bygone age, but it wasn't all roses in the old days. I remember some really dodgy practices including the cane, slipper and a slap across the legs. I am sure there were some teachers who enjoyed beating kids up. And who are these 'trendies' - a new label for this forum. Are these the same as the PC do-gooders that seem to cause problems for a number of forum contributors.

 ;)
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Offline PS

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Re: Career advice for seven-year-olds
« Reply #11 on: October 26, 2009, 02:18:52 pm »
Couldn't agree with you more Bob. I gave up teaching when qualified from Uni - fled the country for a couple of years and returned knowing teaching was not the thing to do. Even then, 30 years ago, and as a result of the 'trendies' then [usually remnants from the hippy 60's] were starting to de-stabilise the great education system we had. God knows what its like today - kids [backed up by parents] always right - teachers always wrong !!! What a state.

And I too am "a fine product of the bygone age" - it never did me any harm, slippers and all !!!   
 

Offline stevea

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Re: Career advice for seven-year-olds
« Reply #12 on: October 26, 2009, 09:33:00 pm »
There is no way that a 7yr old is able to accept career advice. You can show a 7yr old what it's like to be a Fireman, Nurse etc and attempt to show them that jobs are a normality of life, teach them manners, right from wrong etc Unfortunately though, a lot of learnt behaviour comes from the parents so I agree with PS on that one.
I know it's a separate issue, although it is related. Rental accomodation is so expensive that a lot of people have to sign on purely to claim housing benefit. Their jobs simply don't pay enough to cover their rent, let alone other expenses.
 

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Re: Career advice for seven-year-olds
« Reply #13 on: October 26, 2009, 10:22:28 pm »
I agree with David - there's no way it was all roses in the old days. Tell that to the orphans of the bygone era that were sent to Australia for example. A lot of them were repeatedly abused. How can using a cane and being hit with a slipper be acceptable behaviour. What's that going to teach anyone? Who wields the biggest stick is in control? Quite honestly, I think it's a form of perversion.
 

Offline naomi

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Re: Career advice for seven-year-olds
« Reply #14 on: October 26, 2009, 10:56:56 pm »
James - I totally agree with you "pointing out that one choice IS to have a career, which will be a completely alien concept to a lot of these kids." I do not agree with corporal punishment as some seem to. That's not an answer.
When I  look back to my school days, a particular teacher used the cane, but only on children from ethnic backgrounds...that was very wrong and sadistic. Children from minority religions were alienated to the 'Wendy House' at certain times. How can that be a good old days style of teaching? Our daughter has never had teachers described as "trendies"...I never had teachers described as "trendies".
 

LongTallSally

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Re: Career advice for seven-year-olds
« Reply #15 on: October 27, 2009, 06:55:24 am »
Perhaps the best career advice a seven-year-old can have is knowing one or both of their parents have one.

Shouldn't we be tackling the real issue of adult unemployment rather than the smoke and mirrors of fretting if youngsters have made the right choice?
 

Offline Bob Horrocks

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Re: Career advice for seven-year-olds
« Reply #16 on: October 27, 2009, 10:59:43 am »
Our daughter has never had teachers described as "trendies"...I never had teachers described as "trendies".

I meant the people running the education system rather than the teachers themselves. 

Offline naomi

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Re: Career advice for seven-year-olds
« Reply #17 on: October 27, 2009, 11:13:07 am »
Our daughter has never had teachers described as "trendies"...I never had teachers described as "trendies".

I meant the people running the education system rather than the teachers themselves. 

Still not sure that I'd call them "trendies"  ;)
 

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Re: Career advice for seven-year-olds
« Reply #18 on: October 27, 2009, 11:20:40 am »
Perhaps the term 'trendies' is shorthand used as a generalised term to describe people whose views or actions you dislike; a bit like the use of the term 'do-gooders' and 'PC'?

David
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Offline Bob Horrocks

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Re: Career advice for seven-year-olds
« Reply #19 on: October 28, 2009, 02:06:01 pm »
Perhaps the term 'trendies' is shorthand used as a generalised term to describe people whose views or actions you dislike; a bit like the use of the term 'do-gooders' and 'PC'?

David

This debate over a term is getting off the point, and I feel sure that most people know what was meant.   

The question is this - what careers advice can be given to a 7-year old?  When I was 7 and there was still rationing, my ambition was to own a sweet shop.  Any other thoughts on ambitions at that age?

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Re: Career advice for seven-year-olds
« Reply #20 on: October 28, 2009, 02:27:31 pm »
Hi Bob,

I wanted to be a journalist when I was aged seven. I got some old lining paper (used for wallpapering) and cut some sheets into notebook size. I then cut other sheets the size of the Liverpool Echo. Then I went door to door interviewing the neighbours about what they were up to, who they were expecting to visit, how their kids were doing etc, I then wrote the main points of what they told me on the large sheets of paper. I then took my newspaper door to door and then rented it to the neighbours to read for a half penny, which I collected when I went back to pick up my newspaper. It worked well for two editions and I think I made about 3d, but the production and distribution strategy was labour-intensive and fundamentally flawed -- and my contributors/customers got bored with me calling. One even threatened to set the dogs on me. I did three editions before the novelty wore off.

 :-\

Dave
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Offline naomi

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Re: Career advice for seven-year-olds
« Reply #21 on: October 28, 2009, 08:25:19 pm »
Bob - dare I say this! I wanted to be a teacher!  ;)
 

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Re: Career advice for seven-year-olds
« Reply #22 on: October 28, 2009, 09:15:10 pm »
When I was seven Neil Armstrong walked on the moon. I wanted to be an astronaut. Part of me still does, but I work in IT while I wait for NASA to call.
 

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Re: Career advice for seven-year-olds
« Reply #23 on: October 28, 2009, 10:45:30 pm »
I wanted to be a princess, a fairy and a ballet dancer, preferably all at the same time   :D
 

Offline PS

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Re: Career advice for seven-year-olds
« Reply #24 on: October 29, 2009, 12:11:16 am »
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Any other thoughts on ambitions at that age?


Bob - this is getting sad !!! It doesn't matter if the forum debaters wanted to become the pope or a rapist - I thought this was to give seven year olds some advice.

Lets cut the nostalgia now shall we, and stick to the point  !!!
 

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Re: Career advice for seven-year-olds
« Reply #25 on: October 29, 2009, 03:46:54 am »
Mermaid - I'm sure you grew up to be as gorgeous as any Princess!

Myself, I was inspired by Dennis the Menace!  ;D
 

Offline naomi

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Re: Career advice for seven-year-olds
« Reply #26 on: October 29, 2009, 07:00:18 am »
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Any other thoughts on ambitions at that age?


Bob - this is getting sad !!! It doesn't matter if the forum debaters wanted to become the pope or a rapist - I thought this was to give seven year olds some advice.

Lets cut the nostalgia now shall we, and stick to the point  !!!

PS - This is totally relevant and to the point!! It proves that some of us had aspirations at an early age, and from the sounds of it, some of us still have.  There is also nothing wrong with some humour, so perhaps you are the only one that thinks this debate is "sad". 

 

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Re: Career advice for seven-year-olds
« Reply #27 on: October 29, 2009, 08:03:50 am »
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PS - This is totally relevant and to the point!! It proves that some of us had aspirations at an early age, and from the sounds of it, some of us still have.  There is also nothing wrong with some humour, so perhaps you are the only one that thinks this debate is "sad".
 

Naomi- so - it is to the point eh ?. Are we going to tell our seven year olds that its a good idea to become a "princess" or "Dennis the Menace"  now ?? My God - if this how we are going to waste more taxpayers money, then I have an even more serious concern that this country has gone to rack & ruin.

This debate is going nowhere.
 

Offline naomi

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Re: Career advice for seven-year-olds
« Reply #28 on: October 29, 2009, 08:24:32 am »
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PS - This is totally relevant and to the point!! It proves that some of us had aspirations at an early age, and from the sounds of it, some of us still have.  There is also nothing wrong with some humour, so perhaps you are the only one that thinks this debate is "sad".
 

Naomi- so - it is to the point eh ?. Are we going to tell our seven year olds that its a good idea to become a "princess" or "Dennis the Menace"  now ?? My God - if this how we are going to waste more taxpayers money, then I have an even more serious concern that this country has gone to rack & ruin.

This debate is going nowhere.

Perhaps the debate is going nowhere in your eyes only...it doesn't cost to create humour...and I repeat, it is relevant. So what if the ambition was to be a princess or Dennis the Menace..it's still ambition..and if  a child has ambition at an early age, even better. The princess can become a dancer, Dennis might become a mechanic, the astronaut becomes an IT specialist, the journalist becomes..a journalist! No puns intended David. If the career advice takes off, they will be dealing with children that might not have any ambition..it's all intertwined.
 

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Re: Career advice for seven-year-olds
« Reply #29 on: October 29, 2009, 08:30:52 am »

This debate is going nowhere.


Hi PS, I think the aspirations of local residents when they were seven years old ties in nicely with the topic of giving career advice to seven year olds, so, although the debate may well be going nowhere, it is nice to get to know this forum's online community and what makes them tick.

 ;)

David

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