Author Topic: Bollard on Bradmore Green/Brookmans Avenue  (Read 7121 times)

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Offline Grant Shapps MP

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Bollard on Bradmore Green/Brookmans Avenue
« on: June 30, 2009, 11:50:46 am »
I imagine I'm not the only resident who has wondered why that knocked down bollard has been there for so long (outside the Pharmacy).  Here's the story to date: http://www.shapps.com/forum/index.php/topic,4996.0.html

County Highways are usually quick and efficient once something has been reported, but this has been a problem because no one seemed quite sure who owned the land and whose responsibility it was.

 

Offline Grant Shapps MP

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Re: Bollard on Bradmore Green/Brookmans Avenue
« Reply #2 on: September 08, 2009, 05:37:55 am »
Dear Grant,

As you know, you are always welcome to post information on this site in order to update people on local issues. It is as easy for you to copy and paste information to this forum as it is to copy and paste a link to take people through to your site. And of course it saves people having to make another click.

David

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Offline Grant Shapps MP

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Re: Bollard on Bradmore Green/Brookmans Avenue
« Reply #3 on: September 09, 2009, 09:42:04 am »
Dear Grant,

As you know, you are always welcome to post information on this site in order to update people on local issues. It is as easy for you to copy and paste information to this forum as it is to copy and paste a link to take people through to your site. And of course it saves people having to make another click.

David


As we've discussed before. Copy and Paste the same info and maintaining it in 2 locations is impractical. The internet is all about clicking from one place to another and I often post links the other way to interesting threads on Brookmans. If you'd prefer me not to alert your forum to related topics elsewhere then I won't, but I won't be uploading the same pics to multiple locations for lack of time I'm afraid.
 

MikeL

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Re: Bollard on Bradmore Green/Brookmans Avenue
« Reply #4 on: September 09, 2009, 12:28:43 pm »
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The internet is all about clicking from one place to another

Grant, That should be true but unfortunately does not appear to be so in the case of the links you supply. It appears we need to create a user account and log in to your web site in order to follow them. That certainly isn't what the internet is about.
 

Offline Grant Shapps MP

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Re: Bollard on Bradmore Green/Brookmans Avenue
« Reply #5 on: September 09, 2009, 12:42:27 pm »
Quote
It appears we need to create a user account and log in to your web site in order to follow them.

Hi Mike,

That's wrong. When you click on one of these links http://www.shapps.com/forum/index.php?topic=4996.msg45042#msg45042 it goes straight to the post in question and there's no need to sign up or be registered to read the post.

In fact the software is identical (just a later version) to this Forum software and as you know, if you log out as a user, you can still read all the posts.

All the best, Grant.
 

MikeL

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Re: Bollard on Bradmore Green/Brookmans Avenue
« Reply #6 on: September 09, 2009, 01:30:58 pm »
Hi Grant

Not for me it doesn't. I'm told I'm not currently logged in and must register with the Welwyn Hatfied Forum and must also agree to all sorts of conditions before I can progress (which I'm not going to do). I think perhaps because you (and Dave Brewer) are obviously already memebrs and have cookies on your PC containing your log in details it allows you to just jump straight to the link.

It also says "The topic or board you are looking for appears to be either missing or off limits to you.
Please login below or register an account with The Welwyn Hatfield Forum. "


Mike L
 

Offline Grant Shapps MP

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Re: Bollard on Bradmore Green/Brookmans Avenue
« Reply #7 on: September 09, 2009, 01:36:55 pm »
Hi Grant

Not for me it doesn't. I'm told I'm not currently logged in and must register with the Welwyn Hatfied Forum and must also agree to all sorts of conditions before I can progress (which I'm not going to do). I think perhaps because you (and Dave Brewer) are obviously already memebrs and have cookies on your PC containing your log in details it allows you to just jump straight to the link.

Mike L

Hi Mike -

Thanks for that report.  I can't replicate it on any other machine, including those which have never logged into the Welwyn Hatfield Forum before. It is however the case that a message appears near the top encouraging registration - but that certainly doesn't prevent you from scrolling down to read the message - does it?  The forum is definitely open to guests and I can see logs which suggest there are 11 guests viewing it at the time of writing this.

Just to clarify/understand - you're saying that the link posted above takes you to a login screen, but I wonder whether you get there when you simply browse to http://www.shapps.com/forum

 

Offline Ferdie

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Re: Bollard on Bradmore Green/Brookmans Avenue
« Reply #8 on: September 09, 2009, 03:03:38 pm »
Yes the links work fine if registered or not registered, but as Dave has previously advised for this site to accurately reflect the whole picture if contributors could copy & paste in the relevant info from their own site to this forum. That would save everyone the need to navigate away from this site at all. Clearly Grant's post is relevant to this site, so to have all the info would be beneficial.
 

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Re: Bollard on Bradmore Green/Brookmans Avenue
« Reply #9 on: September 09, 2009, 03:55:20 pm »

The internet is all about clicking from one place to another and I often post links the other way to interesting threads on Brookmans. If you'd prefer me not to alert your forum to related topics elsewhere then I won't, but I won't be uploading the same pics to multiple locations for lack of time I'm afraid.


Dear Grant,

Yes, I am aware the internet is about linking, but it is also about offering the best user experience. There will be people who use this forum who are interested in what you have to say and it seems a pity to force them to have to click a link to access that. Far better to share the information here, too. And as for extra work, you seem to have the time to copy links over (as I see you have just done again on the station car park story), so copying the text would take the same amount of time.

I realise you are keen to increase the numbers of users on your forum for political, traffic and revenue-generating reasons, but I think it would be nicer for the users of this forum to be able to benefit from the information you have to share without having to click through to your site.

David
The Brookmans Park Newsletter has been supporting the village and our local community since 1998 by providing free, interactive tools for all to use.
 

Offline Grant Shapps MP

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Re: Bollard on Bradmore Green/Brookmans Avenue
« Reply #10 on: September 09, 2009, 04:42:05 pm »
I realise you are keen to increase the numbers of users on your forum for political, traffic and revenue-generating reasons

David, That's just silly. It's absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with any of your reasons above:

1. I don't run the Welwyn Hatfield Forum for political reasons, otherwise I wouldn't welcome and invite people from all parties to participate, which they do in large numbers. Read any of the threads and you'll see that people come from all angles. Mostly not Tory in fact.

2. The Welwyn Hatfield Forum gets plenty of traffic and another 10 interested visitors is neither here nor there.

3. What revenue?  The odd click on a Google ad on the Welwyn Hatfield Forum barely pays for one day of server usage. Another ten visitors ain't going to make any difference and I'm not bothered or interested one way or the other.

It is simply that I don't want to copy-and-paste images, discussions, threads and in the case of the Brookmans Park Car Park issue, someone else's post (the NCP chap) between different forums. It's completely unnecessary and against the spirit of the way that the free flow of information generally operates on the internet nowadays. In fact, virtually every Twitter post you highlight on Brookmans involves clicking to another site. This is no different.

But since I can't seem to convince you of this, I'll cease cross-posting any further information which is a shame because it means that important developments won't necessarily get picked up by everyone unless they constantly trawl two separate Forums.  And since you mention 'user experience' this would seem to me to be the worst of all worlds.




 

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Re: Bollard on Bradmore Green/Brookmans Avenue
« Reply #11 on: September 09, 2009, 04:48:31 pm »
Dear Grant,

I am not asking you to post discussions and threads from your forum to this one. All I am asking is you post your contribution (and the odd image) that you feel are important to informing the public debate here in this forum. Your decision to stop posting links away from this site is welcome. Please continue to contribute imformation you feel will be of value to your constituents as you used to before setting up your own forum.

David
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Offline chicken legs

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Re: Bollard on Bradmore Green/Brookmans Avenue
« Reply #12 on: September 09, 2009, 05:06:24 pm »
As one who can just about keep up with the above postings, I think it's a shame if the end result is that Grant ceases to post any links which are relevant to Brookmans Park (and/or Welham Green).
 

Offline Mr Green

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Re: Bollard on Bradmore Green/Brookmans Avenue
« Reply #13 on: September 09, 2009, 11:18:50 pm »
Never have I been so split between two camps.

I want this site to be a place to exchange information and comment on local issues. I therefore support the view that issues should be discussed directly on it.

I also understand Grant's position that if he cuts'n'pastes a comment here from elsewhere then he naturally has an obligation to review and respond to replies and he can't be expected maintain different dialogues on the same subject on several different forums simultaneously.

Someone help me off this fence !

 

Offline epiphany

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Re: Bollard on Bradmore Green/Brookmans Avenue
« Reply #14 on: September 10, 2009, 08:56:53 am »
The nitpickin here is total bollards!!
 

Offline Arietor

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Re: Bollard on Bradmore Green/Brookmans Avenue
« Reply #15 on: September 10, 2009, 04:03:18 pm »
Perhaps let me, as the latest new member, add my two halfpence worth and, hopefully, the last word!

Having been a meer voyeur of other peoples' messages since the site was first launched, I felt I had to take time out and register last night and I have just been given the all clear to go.

Surely the point about using a link is that the information presented to the reader will always be up to to date.  If Grant, or anyone else, cuts and pastes some information to our and or anyone else's site, it will remain static and, if viewed next week or next month, may have become out of date or contain an error that has subsequently been corrected at source.

By proper use of the link facility, information will be up to date and our web site will be of best use to its readers.

I rather think that is what the web is all about. Take a look at Wikipedia or any other living, breathing knowledge base.  Although we need to carefully safeguard the integrity of our forum, I do not feel we have to be overly protective of our members' exposure to propaganda or contrary views and opinions and in this particular case I have looked at the link in question .... its just a picture and when I clicked the link it hovered on the Welwyn Hatfield Forum header for a brief nano second before going straight to a photo of said bollard.

Promise not to be so long winded in future postings ....... just the release of a few years' frustrations.
 

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Re: Bollard on Bradmore Green/Brookmans Avenue
« Reply #16 on: September 10, 2009, 04:37:39 pm »
Hi Arietor,

Welcome to the forum. Regarding links, you wrote.


Surely the point about using a link is that the information presented to the reader will always be up to to date.  If Grant, or anyone else, cuts and pastes some information to our and or anyone else's site, it will remain static and, if viewed next week or next month, may have become out of date or contain an error that has subsequently been corrected at source.


Links do not always lead to updated information. Sometimes they do. Forums (such as this one) are interesting in terms of linking because they do tend to update if people contribute to the topic being discussed (although discussions can also go stale and become out of date - but then they just drop down the list). The main thing is to try to keep the discussion alive and relevant and not force the audience to have to visit an alternative forum by offering a link rather than contributing to the debate; that route means that debate here will almost certainly dry up on the topic being discussed. It's also like breaking into a conversation that is happening between a group of people and inviting them to continue the converstation in another place.

David
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Offline chicken legs

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Re: Bollard on Bradmore Green/Brookmans Avenue
« Reply #17 on: September 11, 2009, 11:18:35 am »

Quote
The main thing is to try to keep the discussion alive and relevant and not force the audience to have to visit an alternative forum by offering a link rather than contributing to the debate; that route means that debate here will almost certainly dry up on the topic being discussed. It's also like breaking into a conversation that is happening between a group of people and inviting them to continue the converstation in another place.

David

David, I don't know about others, but I return to the BP site after following a link, and don't think I have ever continued by posting on the visited site.


Fixed quote - John fraser
« Last Edit: September 13, 2009, 12:22:03 pm by John Fraser »
 

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