Author Topic: RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane  (Read 51685 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Largey

  • Opinions on many things
  • ***
  • Posts: 102
RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane
« on: November 07, 2006, 01:10:13 pm »
Does anyone know why the RVC has dozens of vehicles parked along Hawkeshead Lane. ?   Over the last few weeks these cars have caused problems on an already narrow road. I noticed that a week or so ago the cars were paked all along the verge. They were subjected, quite rightly, to stickers from the local authority reminding them about restrictions about parking on the verge. Police have also been in attendance looking at the problem. Why are these vehicles there and surely there must be enough space to accomodate them within the grounds of the RVC without having to disturb the flow of traffic along the lane.   :icon_scratch:
 

Offline Mermaid

  • Forum Moderator
  • Opinions on everything
  • *****
  • Posts: 1574
  • Thanked: 30 times
  • Gender: Female
  • Forum Member
Re: RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane
« Reply #1 on: November 07, 2006, 01:20:35 pm »

There may have been something about this in the WH Times recently. I didn't see the whole article but I think it was something to do with the RVC saying that the students couldn't park their cars in the RVC car park any more. This was the article which was accompanied by a picture of a student lying in the road surrounded by other students protesting.

I may be wrong of course.........
 

Offline Cassie

  • Opinions on many things
  • ***
  • Posts: 185
  • Gender: Female
  • Forum Member
Re: RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane
« Reply #2 on: November 07, 2006, 01:55:22 pm »

There may have been something about this in the WH Times recently. I didn't see the whole article but I think it was something to do with the RVC saying that the students couldn't park their cars in the RVC car park any more. This was the article which was accompanied by a picture of a student lying in the road surrounded by other students protesting.

I may be wrong of course.........

story here
 

Offline Abbot

  • Opinions on some things
  • **
  • Posts: 83
  • Thanked: 1 times
  • Forum Member
Re: RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane
« Reply #3 on: November 07, 2006, 04:00:51 pm »
Any idea when the footpath by the railway from Potters Bar station to Hawkshead road will reopen. The vegetation might have grown a bit??
 

Offline Peter Hastings

  • Opinions on many things
  • ***
  • Posts: 491
  • Gender: Male
  • Forum Member
Re: RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane
« Reply #4 on: November 07, 2006, 08:18:29 pm »
I think the problem with the RVC is they are trying to encourage green transport by making it hard to park cars on their property. The students have responded by parking on the verge. I can tell you the Parish Council has made enquiries of the RVC as to their plans and is awaiting a response.
 

Offline peppermint

  • Opinions on many things
  • ***
  • Posts: 364
  • Thanked: 11 times
  • Forum Member
Re: RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane
« Reply #5 on: November 07, 2006, 08:56:29 pm »
I do feel for the students.   The college isn't exactly placed in a convenient location for walking, with no footpaths.   This makes it particularly hazardous in the morning when Hawkshead Road becomes a rat run and I certainly wouldn't be happy to know that my daughter might be walking from Potters Bar/Welham Green in the dark along an unlit road with no footpath.  I understand that there is a small minibus but this is hardly sufficient to ship all of the students who need to get to the college.   £2.00 per day to be brought to and from Potters Bar or Welham Green!   It seems like someone is making a tidy sum out of the students, particularly when there is no real alternative transport to get them safely to the college.   On the other hand, if the students are not being given the option of parking in the RVC carpark, where were they all parking in the past before the large car park was built?    If the only offence they are committing is parking on a grass verge then perhaps they could park on the road, after all, it was probably only their consideration of other drivers which has resulted in them parking on the verges in the first place.   This shouldn't bother the residents of Hawkshead Road as it would be impossible for them to park on the verges outside most of the houses due to the huge lumps of concrete many of they have already placed there to mark their boundaries.
 

Offline Bob Horrocks

  • Opinions on everything
  • *****
  • Posts: 1555
  • Gender: Male
  • Expertises:
  • Green Belt
  • Parish Council
Re: RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane
« Reply #6 on: November 08, 2006, 11:11:43 am »
The students are now parking legally but they are creating a traffic hazard, particularly when a horse box or some other large vehicle is going along that stretch of road.  The lane is a well-used cut-through to get to and from the M25 at South Mimms junction and a survey by the RVC a few years ago showed that RVC-generated traffic was only a small proportion of the road users.

The bus service had been going to the RVC but I have not seen any bus recently on Hawkshead Lane.  Does anyone know if it still services the college?  I feel certain this diversion was subsidised by the RVC.

A year or two ago, the parish council did ask Herts Highways for a proper footpath beside the roadway between Boltons Farm on Hawkshead Road and the RVC but it seems to be still on the 'wish list' at Herts Highways.  On Hawkshead Road the crude footpath west of Boltons Farm was improved some years ago by someone (who?) putting down gravel.  However when Herts Highways were asked last year (I think) to put more gravel down, they claimed no knowledge of the path's existance.  They did cut back the vegitation but of course it grew again and that path is almost unusable.

The Friday Grove 'country house' proposals included a footpath alongside the road on the boundary of the 20-acre field site in order to get local support for the huge house on Green Belt land, but that is another story! 

colinr

  • Guest
Re: RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane
« Reply #7 on: November 08, 2006, 05:26:46 pm »
I travel past the RVC most days and the (legal) parking of vehicles has made the journey rather dangerous. The main problem is cars are parked opposite each other in several places so you the driver, and the approaching traffic have limited space to pull into to pass each other, and just to hinder the situation even more a white car has been parked for several weeks at another passing point near the bottom of Hawkshead on the bend. Once you negotiate that obstacle, you then have the area by the lorry park at South Mimms to contend with. Large articulated vehicles parked in the lay-bys (the lay-bys that have large yellow NO PARKING signs in them) as well as parking on the kerbs and jutting out into the road, sometimes it can take 10-15 mins to navigate this area to get onto the South Mimms roundabout. I did make this point to Grant Shapps a while ago, and although he found the same problem annoying he told me that that area is not covered by Welwyn and Hatfield but by the Met. Strange why the Police who regularly patrol this area (well get their coffee and burgers) by the services don’t have a blitz on these illegal lorry parkers! They could make nearly as much money as they do from safety cameras, but I guess that would involve getting out of their cars with a full stomach!
 :icon_jokercolor:
 

Offline PC Jo Wakelen

  • Opinions on some things
  • **
  • Posts: 25
  • Gender: Female
  • Log on to message me using the email icon below
    • Hertfordshire Constabulary
Re: RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane
« Reply #8 on: November 09, 2006, 01:51:01 am »
Hi Folks,
Just thought I would give a quick update to the Hawkshead Lane traffic problems.

Recently the RVC banned some students from parking on site, this is due to them have building work done and neading the space.

The students have therefore been parking outside on Hawkshead Lane.  At first they parked on the verge and then Welwyn and Hatfield Council issued large posters on the cars asking for this to cease, which it has.

I myself have been involved in this situation alot over the past couple of weeks.  I sympathise with all parties involved and this is a far from ideal situation.

I have been issuing fines to cars which have mounted the footpath, parked causing an obstruction both to vision and physical obstruction.  This will also continue to be my line of action.  The RVC had asked for planning permission to make a temporary car park, but the application has been turned down.

The RVC also has been putting on buses to  transport students from campus to home.

I am currently liasing with all parties involved to gain an amicable solution to this situation.

Many thanks

Jo
PC Jo Wakelen, the community police officer for Brookmans Park and Little Heath. For all emergencies, please call 999. For non-emergencies, please calll 0845 33 00222. To contact our local office, ring 01707-638112.
 

Offline Bob Horrocks

  • Opinions on everything
  • *****
  • Posts: 1555
  • Gender: Male
  • Expertises:
  • Green Belt
  • Parish Council
Re: RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane
« Reply #9 on: November 09, 2006, 11:09:50 am »
It was news to me that the RVC had been refused a temporary car park.  The Welwyn Hatfield council's planning database has no such application listed. 

As chairman of planning at the parish council I see every planning application in this parish,  The most recent relevant one, approved in March 2006, was to extend the hospital for small animals to form educational & clinical facilities, access, parking, landscaping, & re-site temporary building .  Perhaps that is the building works causing the problem.

Maybe Jo should ask the RVC for proof of the claimed refusal of permission.  It is very gratifying to see that she is acting on this situation before an accident happens, assuming none has happened of course.  Prevention is far better than cure.  But it may not show up on any target score, sadly.

One or two answers might be for Welwyn Hatfield Council to permit parking on the verge on a temporary basis, or the RVC to allow parking on the playing fields opposite the college.  It is not rocket science is it?

moggins

  • Guest
Re: RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane
« Reply #10 on: November 09, 2006, 09:14:37 pm »
Look with reference to the problems with the cars, I used to regularly walk in and around the area where the students are parking, if this has the effrect of slowing down the cars which regularly used to speed past with no thought or consideration for the walker on foot whether accompamied by a dog or not then is it really such a bad thing.
I might be just imagining this but is it not the job of the local constabulary to have a presence in order to deter those criminals seeking to cause mischief.
The gist of the notes written by the new :beat officer" seems to be to raise the awareness of how it is in our interest that fines are being levied left right and centre , I have a suggestion up the police patrols around the immediate area to deter criminals, open the police stations in the locale so people have got somewhere to go when they are victims of crime and stop picking on the old cash cow the law abiding motorist. we need more police doing police work than police daylighting as traffic wardens.
Read previous posts if you thimk I am making this up
 

Offline Mallow

  • Opinions on many things
  • ***
  • Posts: 111
  • Gender: Female
  • Forum Member
Re: RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane
« Reply #11 on: November 10, 2006, 12:25:54 pm »
and just to hinder the situation even more a white car has been parked for several weeks at another passing point near the bottom of Hawkshead on the bend.
 :icon_jokercolor:

Just for your information, this is a privately owned car parked on a privately owned peice of land.  In both cases the owner is the same person.  It is a bit like you parking your own car on your own drive ;D
Life is not about waiting for the storm to pass, it's about learning to dance in the rain!
 

Offline PC Jo Wakelen

  • Opinions on some things
  • **
  • Posts: 25
  • Gender: Female
  • Log on to message me using the email icon below
    • Hertfordshire Constabulary
Re: RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane
« Reply #12 on: November 10, 2006, 12:26:56 pm »
Hi Folks,

I have taken note of people's comments. 

Please let me clarify, the tickets have been given for those who have caused a physical and visual obstructions only.  This is not a way for the constabulary making cash out of motorists.  It is there as a prevention of obstruction other road users, which potentially will prevent an accident happening.
 
A mention to opening the police stations in order for victims of crime to attend, both police stations in the area are open. 

Hatfield is open 24 hours a day and Potters Bar although has restricted hours, still has police officers working out of it most times of the day.  Should anyone need urgent police assistance then they can call 999 and officers will attend immediately.

As I am the Ward officer there is only so much I  can do to patrol this area in any one day, I also cover Newgate Street, Little Heath, Bell Bar and Brookmans Park and I have tried to make my prescence known as much as possible.

I am currently putting together a report about the area in order to put a stop to the parking by the students as I am very aware of the knock on effect this is having on residents lives.  I also am working on traffic controls in the area, regarding speeding etc as the lane is used as a "Rat Run" by people taking short cuts.

I will look into the issue that there has been no application by the RVC for setting up a field to be used as extra parking. 
The issue of detering criminals in the area, hopefully a visible prescence of myself and Steve Harvey should be a warning to criminals in the area.

All I can ask is that you please bear with PCSO Steve Harvey and myself  on this issue.

Many Thanks

Jo
« Last Edit: November 10, 2006, 06:52:15 pm by David Brewer »
PC Jo Wakelen, the community police officer for Brookmans Park and Little Heath. For all emergencies, please call 999. For non-emergencies, please calll 0845 33 00222. To contact our local office, ring 01707-638112.
 

Offline Cassie

  • Opinions on many things
  • ***
  • Posts: 185
  • Gender: Female
  • Forum Member
Re: RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane
« Reply #13 on: November 10, 2006, 01:27:58 pm »
and just to hinder the situation even more a white car has been parked for several weeks at another passing point near the bottom of Hawkshead on the bend.
 :icon_jokercolor:

Just for your information, this is a privately owned car parked on a privately owned peice of land.  In both cases the owner is the same person.  It is a bit like you parking your own car on your own drive ;D

Since when has 'a passing point' been privately owned?  Surely it is there for the use of all road users

Editor's Note: Edited only to separate two quotes.
« Last Edit: November 10, 2006, 01:56:14 pm by David Brewer »
 

Offline Mermaid

  • Forum Moderator
  • Opinions on everything
  • *****
  • Posts: 1574
  • Thanked: 30 times
  • Gender: Female
  • Forum Member
Re: RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane
« Reply #14 on: November 10, 2006, 02:38:05 pm »

In reply to Moggins I would point out that the police are not 'picking on the old cash cow the law abiding motorist', far from it. Those that get 'picked on' ARE breaking the law!

If you are speeding in your car you are breaking the law, if you are using a mobile which is not 'hands-free whilst driving you are breaking the law, if you are not wearing a seat-belt, you are breaking the law, if children are not seated or belted securely you are breaking the law, if you are parked illegally you are breaking the law. All of these laws are there for a reason.

I am delighted that PC Wakelen is issuing tickets to motorists breaking the law. Maybe the offenders - many of whom have been breaking the law with impunity for so long that they think it's their entitlement to do so - will now pay a bit more attention to careful and considerate driving.
 

Offline Mallow

  • Opinions on many things
  • ***
  • Posts: 111
  • Gender: Female
  • Forum Member
Re: RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane
« Reply #15 on: November 10, 2006, 04:07:05 pm »
Since when has 'a passing point' been privately owned?  Surely it is there for the use of all road users

That is the point I am trying to make, it is not a passing place it is a piece of land owned by one of the properties in Hawkshead Lane and it used to have their garage on it.  That would make it their driveway to their garage, however the garage is no longer there.  I think that entitles them to park their car there.
 ???

Editor's note: Edited only to correct a link in the quote.
« Last Edit: November 10, 2006, 04:39:06 pm by David Brewer »
Life is not about waiting for the storm to pass, it's about learning to dance in the rain!
 

Offline rhian Gabriel

  • Opinions on some things
  • **
  • Posts: 3
  • Forum Member
Re: RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane
« Reply #16 on: November 13, 2006, 12:05:28 pm »
I would like to add some comments as a third year student at the RVC. At the start of term all third years were told that they were banned from driving on site as they are building on the small animal hospital car park, so patients will need to use our car park. Obviously, with the campus being in the middle of nowhere most of us found this outrageous.

They provided one bus in the morning and bus in the evening at £1 per journey, which most of us were unwillling to pay, especially picking up from Bolton Park Farm, so we had no choice but to park on the verges. The reason we parked there was because we did not want to block the roads by parking as we are now, it was not because we wanted to break the law. They now provide an extra bus at lunchtime, but for most of the students this is not flexible enough by any means. As a graduate from another University i find this whole situation totally unacceptable as the site is there primarily to teach students.

When we all got stickers on our cars for parking on the verges, which i still can't get off my window, we were told to park on the road by the council as we are not breaking any laws by doing so.

My big concern, that has been previously raised, is that the college have not made any effort to provide a car park. They told us they applied for permission on the fields opposite and tried every way to get planning permission. It would be very helpful if this could be investigated to see if college did infact get a refusal of planning for parking.

Unfortunately college have tried to pass this problem off as a "Green Issue" to get on the publc's side which is not the case at all, as everyone car shares and the coaches they are using emit far more pollution than our few cars.

I hope that this illustrates what we have had to deal with on top of all our work and that we can have some local support for doing what we are doing...we have no other choice i am afraid.

All the best, Rhian
 

Offline peppermint

  • Opinions on many things
  • ***
  • Posts: 364
  • Thanked: 11 times
  • Forum Member
Re: RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane
« Reply #17 on: November 13, 2006, 04:08:51 pm »
I totally agree with you.
 

John_fraser

  • Guest
Re: RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane
« Reply #18 on: November 13, 2006, 04:21:40 pm »
minor aside
Quote
When we all got stickers on our cars for parking on the verges, which i still can't get off my window, we were told to park on the road by the council as we are not breaking any laws by doing so.

Good!
 

Offline peppermint

  • Opinions on many things
  • ***
  • Posts: 364
  • Thanked: 11 times
  • Forum Member
Re: RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane
« Reply #19 on: November 13, 2006, 05:55:40 pm »
What I can't understand is why the student parking has become such issue.   They have been asked to park on the road due to work being carried out at the College - end of story.   I am sure this would not have been a problem if they had just been allowed to get on with it, but for some reason both the Council and the police were alerted to the verge parking.   

Why is this a problem, it is not as if they are blocking pavements. 

I drive past the College in the mornings and whilst I may occasionally have to wait for oncoming traffic to pass, don't most of us have to do just that many times a day driving around the area.

What I would like to know is who took it upon themselves to bring it to the attention of the authorities.

I would take a guess that it is probably the local residents.   Yet again we have a case of residents complaining about motorists.   Did they not know the college was there when they bought their houses?

Perhaps it should also be an offence  for homeowners to place large lumps of unsightly concrete along the grass verges as an alternative to building a proper boundary wall.    They certainly are more of a driving hazard than the students cars.

At least if they were painted white and the grass was cut around them so that they could be seen they would not be clipped by motorists passing them.   This is something I have seen happen on three occasions.
 

Offline rhian Gabriel

  • Opinions on some things
  • **
  • Posts: 3
  • Forum Member
Re: RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane
« Reply #20 on: November 13, 2006, 06:45:30 pm »
At the moment i think the situation is fine with the number of cars parked on the road. However, as of next year none of the students are allowed to park on site, so this will inflict more cars on the roadside, which i highly doubt the locals will be impressed with!
 

Offline Nonloso

  • Opinions on some things
  • **
  • Posts: 31
  • Forum Member
Re: RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane
« Reply #21 on: November 13, 2006, 07:43:34 pm »
I'm glad to see that the police are taking action to stop parking on the verges ih Hawkshead Lane. However, they never take action to stop parking on the verges and pavements in the village so there is a case of double standards here. I can't see why they clamp down on the students but not the residents. Many of the verges in Bluebridge Road have been completely destroyed by the residents and cars are parked on the pavements everywhere in the village.
 

Offline Mallow

  • Opinions on many things
  • ***
  • Posts: 111
  • Gender: Female
  • Forum Member
Re: RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane
« Reply #22 on: November 14, 2006, 01:48:34 pm »
Perhaps it should also be an offence  for homeowners to place large lumps of unsightly concrete along the grass verges as an alternative to building a proper boundary wall.    

The probable reason for them not building a boundary wall is because in most cases the last three or four foot of verge is owned by the council so it is not their land to build on.  However, the council will not maintain these verges so the residents try to preserve them from being trashed by large vehicles which ingore the 3 ton weight limit on the bridge - most of which are visiting the RVC.   In some cases residents have requested the council to install raised kerbs and the council have obliged.
Life is not about waiting for the storm to pass, it's about learning to dance in the rain!
 

colinr

  • Guest
Re: RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane
« Reply #23 on: November 14, 2006, 07:59:28 pm »
Since when has 'a passing point' been privately owned?  Surely it is there for the use of all road users

That is the point I am trying to make, it is not a passing place it is a piece of land owned by one of the properties in Hawkshead Lane and it used to have their garage on it.  That would make it their driveway to their garage, however the garage is no longer there.  I think that entitles them to park their car there.
 ???

My dear Mallow I do agree with you that the white car is not parked illegally it is parked on “private land” (I have however lived in BP For 25 years and can’t recall a garage being there but maybe I am wrong you obviously know your own property) The point is that the car restricts you “hugging the curb” as you round the bend, so you automatically give it a wider berth. If it wasn’t there you would drive closer to the curb.
Only tonight an AA pickup was coming down the road and myself and a line of cars were coming up Hawkshead, we all had to manoeuvre into the drive of the house opposite the white car. I am only making an observation if it was my car I would be concerned about leaving it in a vulnerable place.
Its rather like the Volvo people have complained about at the junction of Bluebridge and The Gardens, nothing wrong in the eyes of the law but common sense suggests if I move it back or forwards or in my drive I am not a hazard and it will not get bumped by a horse box or a large vehicle .
But Mallow life’s too short to worry about all this, so take my comments with a pinch of salt, and a Merry Festive Season to you.  :icon_jokercolor:
PS I hope Santa (Rotary Club) don’t try to bring their sleight down Hawksheds they won’t get through!!
 ;D


Editor's note: Edited only to correct a link in the quote.
« Last Edit: November 14, 2006, 10:30:56 pm by David Brewer »
 

Offline Mallow

  • Opinions on many things
  • ***
  • Posts: 111
  • Gender: Female
  • Forum Member
Re: RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane
« Reply #24 on: November 15, 2006, 01:08:53 pm »
Completely agree with you Colin.  Not my car or land by the way.  Just wanted to make the point that there are not really any passing places in Hawkshead lane there are just driveways, and slightly wider bits of road which is why the RVC parking is presenting a problem just now.

 :icon_jokercolor:

PS Where can I go to see Santa on his Sleigh?
Life is not about waiting for the storm to pass, it's about learning to dance in the rain!
 

Offline Bob Horrocks

  • Opinions on everything
  • *****
  • Posts: 1555
  • Gender: Male
  • Expertises:
  • Green Belt
  • Parish Council
Re: RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane
« Reply #25 on: November 15, 2006, 04:39:34 pm »
Last year Santo and his sleigh came to the Bradmore Green Christmas lights switching on ceremony.  This year it is advertised as being at 6.30pm on Tuesday 28 November.  I do not know if he can make it again this year, but you never know.

Offline Mermaid

  • Forum Moderator
  • Opinions on everything
  • *****
  • Posts: 1574
  • Thanked: 30 times
  • Gender: Female
  • Forum Member
Re: RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane
« Reply #26 on: November 15, 2006, 04:49:03 pm »

It depends if you've all been good enough - well, have you ....? ;D
 

Offline peppermint

  • Opinions on many things
  • ***
  • Posts: 364
  • Thanked: 11 times
  • Forum Member
Re: RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane
« Reply #27 on: November 15, 2006, 05:19:44 pm »
I think it  says on the leaflet in the noticeboard on the green that Santa and his sleigh will be there for the turning on of the Christmas tree lights. :icon_jokercolor:
 

Offline Peter Hastings

  • Opinions on many things
  • ***
  • Posts: 491
  • Gender: Male
  • Forum Member
Re: RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane
« Reply #28 on: November 16, 2006, 06:58:16 pm »
Back to the RVC parking issue....I would be interested to hear from Rhian or anyone else whether there was any consultation before the new "green" transport policy was brought in. Also are the students represented in any way- did they discuss the £1 cost per journey which is relatively low and the benefit of coach travel-no car maintenance, tyre wear and petrol as opposed to the cost? Is there any evidence as to where the balance lies on the cost question?

Is there any on-going communication between the students and the college?

Not taking sides here just trying to get information out in public if there is any available.
 

Offline rhian Gabriel

  • Opinions on some things
  • **
  • Posts: 3
  • Forum Member
Re: RVC parking in Hawkshead Lane
« Reply #29 on: November 16, 2006, 07:50:12 pm »
We have three year reps, who have done a brillaint job and managed to get another bus at lunch and 50p per journey, which is a more sensible price for us poor students. We all now appreciate that college have done their best, however, the cost is not the issue for most people still parking on the road, it is the flexibility. We are university students and not school children so are not expected to be on site from 9 till 5. Having a car means that we can come and go, which i personally have to do to walk my dogs.

As of next week we will be parking on the opposite side of the road as cars coming off site are finding it difficult to pull out on to the road. If anyone driving down this road finds this a problem let me know so i can relay it back to college.

I am still interested if anyone has any info on whether planning for an extra car park was actually submitted.
 

Tags: