Author Topic: School Coaches  (Read 27532 times)

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Offline Margaret

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Re: School Coaches
« Reply #30 on: February 05, 2004, 10:25:26 am »
I think the editor has hit the nail on the head, coaches are necessary to transport some children but are our village roads appropriate for large buses and the volume of traffic caused by the childrens parents. Or come to that the increase in larger vehicles all together. When building work is carried out nowdays they seem to need huge lorries and several of them, where in 'The Good Ol' Days' a small truck was enough! ???
 

Offline JESB

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Re: School Coaches
« Reply #31 on: March 11, 2008, 07:17:39 pm »
Has anyone else noticed the dreadfull problem around top end of Moffats/Mymms drive every morning when no less than THREE coaches pull up at the top of the road and park on the corner to pick up large amounts of children.  It is without doubt the most dangerous,accident waiting to happen place for coaches to park ever.  The parents of these children park their cars without regard for the people who's drives they block with their engines running pumping out fumes in order that their little darlings do not get cold.  They race up Mymms Drive like maniacs quite often late drop off children and then stand and talk blocking the corner of the road.  It is impossible to see around the coaches and it is necessary to pull out into the middle of Mymms drive to turn right. How can this have been allowed! who made the decision to make Moffats a coach stop? I don't remember being asked if We wanted it.  I wonder if our local community police would like to drive along the road at that time of the morning and find out what is going on rather than have to turn up when there is a fatality caused by bad driving and bad parking.
 

Offline Editor

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Re: School Coaches
« Reply #32 on: March 11, 2008, 07:39:10 pm »
Hi JESB,

I split your post about the coaches from the speeding thread and merged it with an existing thread on school coaches in order to keep all posts on a similar theme together.

David
The Brookmans Park Newsletter has been supporting the village and our local community since 1998 by providing free, interactive tools for all to use.
 

Offline Alfred the Great

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Re: School Coaches
« Reply #33 on: March 11, 2008, 09:47:23 pm »
I think this issue was done to death a few years ago when one of the neighbours was pelting the kids with coins. Moffats Lane is public highway and coaches have a right to pass along it and perform pickups at reasonable times. Yes it is a bit hairy at 7.50am and probably less hairy in the afternoon when the coaches are more staggered in their arrival times. The parents could also be a bit more considerate in their parking. But don't forget, the coaches are serving local people and we all have a right to exist. Sometimes things aren't as smooth as they could be but that's how life is.

ATG
Confucius he say "a dog is for life not just for Christmas Dinner"
 

Offline JESB

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Re: School Coaches
« Reply #34 on: March 11, 2008, 10:36:24 pm »
my point was that the situation has got much worse as I have lived in Moffats Lane for 22 years and seen the changes.  It is now almost impossible to get out of the drive in the morning for cars and coaches speeding up and down.  Lucky for those living in Brookmans Avenue who had humps put down so diverting the main traffic on to Moffats Lane a much more unsafe road.  The children waiting for the coaches are inconsiderate to those trying to pass by on many an occassion I have had to walk in the road to get by them.  The parents who are equally inconsiderate and block driveways. Many of the people who are using this service do not infact live in Brookmans Park.  Those that do show even more arrogance and pure lazyness in not walking their offspring to the coach.  Surley if a situation becomes much worse and the highways become blocked and dangerous it is not unacceptable to bring the debate to the attention of everyone again.  Or perhaps we should all sit back and wait for a child or car to be involved in a serious accident and then say we should have done something about it.
 

Offline peppermint

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Re: School Coaches
« Reply #35 on: March 11, 2008, 11:00:47 pm »
I think you are trying to justify your views  by using the "accident waiting to happen" argument.
Be honest, you dont like people parking outside your house, and how dare they, they dont even live in
Brookmans Park!
 

Offline Abbot

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Re: School Coaches
« Reply #36 on: March 11, 2008, 11:47:39 pm »
So who knocked the Street Lamp into the conifers, and why were the wooden railings put up on the grass verge.

Why do we cart school children in cars to a cross roads.

They should be picked up from outside my house.
 

Offline JESB

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Re: School Coaches
« Reply #37 on: March 13, 2008, 06:51:29 pm »
I still don't feel that bringing a dangerous situation in for debate is a bad thing.  I feel sorry for those people who do have their drives blocked by mums who just want to keep warm and have a chat.  I do not have the problem of them parking outside my house because I live further down the road, but do have problems getting out of the drive in the morning to go to work with the amount of traffic.  A classic example of the problem caused happened this morning when a female driver travelling towards the end of Moffats lane crossed the road to park on the corner opposit the post  box facing the wrong way to let a child out to catch the bus waiting in Mymms drive.  She promptly left the vehicle and wandered off for a chat making it impossible for traffic turning left into Moffats who had already negotiated their way around the bus her child was getting on  narrowly missing a car travelling down moffats.   

 

Offline Cassie

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Re: School Coaches
« Reply #38 on: March 13, 2008, 10:31:12 pm »
The Highway Code says:

"DO NOT stop or park

opposite or within 10 metres (32 feet) of a junction, except in an authorised parking space"
 

but it seems that the coaches and parents picking up and dropping off children do just that and that's the main problem - it's hazardous to other road users by blocking views etc.

I really don't understand why anyone would deem Moffats Lane as a suitable place for coaches to stop.  The road at the bend is quite narrow and is dangerous enough as it is for cars.  Surely somewhere on Bradmore Green would be more suitable for picking up and dropping off school children as there are bus stops there.
 

Offline Ferdie

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Re: School Coaches
« Reply #39 on: March 14, 2008, 07:45:06 am »
Surely somewhere on Bradmore Green would be more suitable for picking up and dropping off school children as there are bus stops there.
Ahh but our little darlings will have to use their legs to walk there, or the 4X4's will add to global warming as they are driven to within inches of the bus stop, not to mention the already madness of BP village that already exists at school in & out times. The cars are often waiting quite some time at Moffats/Calder/Mymms, there's precious little parking for shoppers as it is at the shops.

Totally agree though, the junction is a nightmare due to inconsiderate parking. What is wrong with walking? If the children do have a way to go after the coach drops off, why can't the parent and child arrange a meeting point a few hundred yards away, in a safer, quieter place? I used to walk a mile each way to school and that was pre teenage. I know things are perceived not as safe now as then, but really, is our fear overtaking rationality? Is every car picking up a youngster with over a mile to their home? I doubt it.
 

Offline mlr

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Re: School Coaches
« Reply #40 on: March 14, 2008, 09:58:53 am »
Ferdie - there is a time factor involved too. I personally don't use the coach stop in Mymms Drive but I do drop off in the village. Yes, we probably do live less than a mile from the stop but I have to get to work and wouldn't have time to walk home and get the car and get to work on time.
Not all mums are on their way home again after drop off!
 

Offline AK

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Re: School Coaches
« Reply #41 on: March 14, 2008, 11:22:59 pm »
mlr, is there no other parent walking their child to the village center that your child could walk with? Within a mile of the stop, it seems difficult to believe, unless you live out of the village along a high-speed stretch of road, such as Bluebridge or Station Road.
 

Offline Grumpy Old Roy

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Re: School Coaches
« Reply #42 on: March 15, 2008, 10:20:11 am »
 
 School Coaches
 
Whilst we do not have the problem of coaches in Bradmore Way (although some of the 4x4s look like coaches) we do have the problem of inconsiderate parking by parents who insist on using a vehicle the size of a tank for one little darling.

As a resident of Bradmore way I have actually witnessed two mothers parked side by side, facing in opposite directions chatting away from there cars, and then, believe it or not, getting annoyed when I requested them to move. They also park opposite my drive making it impossible to turn into.

I understand the need to get children to school, but, is it beyond the wit of these parents to organise a rota system so that one car (read tank) take four of five children.

 Better still, for the health of children why not a school train were by the children all walk to school under the supervision of two or three parent. Much healthier, more community spirited.

Come on ladies, think of other people, all we are requesting is a little courtesy. Thanks

This time, really Grumpy Old Roy

PS. Just had an idea, why not get the government to confiscate all the 4x4s, paint them in camouflage, send them to Afghanistan as the Ist Brookmans Park Mothers Tank Regiment. Seeing them parked, the tribesman would surrender on mass the first morning. Job done
 

Offline AK

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Re: School Coaches
« Reply #43 on: March 15, 2008, 05:16:03 pm »
Grumpy, I think your idea is a good one. I have very fond memories of walking to elementary school with my local friends. In the US, where the spaces between communities are larger, it is viewed as a real luxury to be able to do walk. The close proximity of the primary school is one of the main reasons we moved to Brookmans Park. Unfortunately, it appears that the 'car culture' has taken over in the UK as well, even in smaller communities.
 

Offline sharks

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Re: School Coaches
« Reply #44 on: March 16, 2008, 06:45:49 pm »
PS. Just had an idea, why not get the government to confiscate all the 4x4s, paint them in camouflage, send them to Afghanistan as the Ist Brookmans Park Mothers Tank Regiment. Seeing them parked, the tribesman would surrender on mass the first morning. Job done

Did you mean that the tribesman will surrender at the sight of the mothers parked or the 4x4's parked? ;D
 

Offline mlr

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Re: School Coaches
« Reply #45 on: March 17, 2008, 01:04:01 pm »
AK - I never pass anyone walking with their kids but even if I did, and I managed to persuade that stranger to walk my 2 kids with theirs, am I then supposed to pass said hapless stranger plus my kids in my car on the way to work, waving gaily at them as they trudge through the pouring rain? And to achieve what, exactly? I'm going that way anyway, so there would not be any saving of carbon emissions -and I stop for a total of 5 mins in a designated parking space in the village, so I can't tell what your concern is. 
 

Offline Grumpy Old Roy

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Re: School Coaches
« Reply #46 on: March 17, 2008, 06:39:43 pm »
 
 Parking of 4X4s in Bradmore Way.
 In reply to Sharks enquiry, I did mean both, if the tribesman surrender we have won, if not we could always sell the mums and the 4x4s to them for maybe 50 goats and 20 racing camels,  No more 4x4s in Bradmore Way and we could sell the goats at a profit to the local kebab shop in fact, a win win situation. I'm not sure about the camels though, any suggestions ?

As regards to the other comments about children having to walk in the the rain when the parent is going that way. Surely it is so much healthier for children to walk to school rather than being corseted in a piece of steel, and if it rains, well there are things called raincoats and wellingtons, children do not melt. If we are really concerned about our children, then is it not better to introduce them to the joy of walking and seeing things for themselves rather than through a car window. Who are we really worrying about here, the children or organising a busy life. How do you think we got to school before cars???

Grumpy Old Roy
 

Offline mungroo

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Re: School Coaches
« Reply #47 on: March 18, 2008, 07:04:47 am »
While visiting friends in Switzerland last year I was stunned to see that all the kids walk to school on their own (within reason). The children in the family we stayed with were a little older than mine (about 5 & 7) but they were quite happy to go alone. The parents were reluctant at first but the school insisted and now they are quite used to it - the children wear special reflective uniforms. This obviously has several benefits such as reduced car use, exercise for the kids, the children gain confidence etc. I know there are the obvious dangers but it was remarkable that the Swiss people were maintaining a policy of not overly shielding their children. Quite a contrast to this country I have to say.
 

Offline mlr

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Re: School Coaches
« Reply #48 on: March 18, 2008, 09:11:44 am »
For your information Roy, we do go for long country walks (yes, even in the rain!) at weekends - my point is that 7.30am on a school morning when we all have things to do and places to be is not the time for such walks. I don't see why parents need to justify taking their children to school by car - if it makes everyone's life a bit easier, so be it. You have no idea what other outdoors activities those parents do do with their kids - they just choose a more convenient time to do it!
 

Offline Grumpy Old Roy

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Re: School Coaches
« Reply #49 on: March 18, 2008, 06:35:56 pm »
 
 In reply to Mir's comments of. what are my concerns, They are precisely that, no one seems to have any concern any more for the inconvenience caused to other people. Bradmore Way is virtually impassable morning and evening with big cars carrying just one child. What would happen if an ambulance wanted to get through? Are you really saying you will not give a few moments thought to how the volume of cars could be reduced? Remember the car causing the problem is not the one in front or behind, it's you

 All we are requesting is that parents have a little thought for the residents of Bradmore Way, is that unreasonable? We live in a small society and should all be aware of our neighbors needs and what we can do to improve how we live. My, how life has changed.

Grumpy, disappointed, and glad he's on the way out, not on the way in, old Roy

 

Offline AK

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Re: School Coaches
« Reply #50 on: March 21, 2008, 02:06:57 pm »
AK - I never pass anyone walking with their kids but even if I did, and I managed to persuade that stranger to walk my 2 kids with theirs, am I then supposed to pass said hapless stranger plus my kids in my car on the way to work, waving gaily at them as they trudge through the pouring rain? And to achieve what, exactly? I'm going that way anyway, so there would not be any saving of carbon emissions -and I stop for a total of 5 mins in a designated parking space in the village, so I can't tell what your concern is. 

All very sad - not knowing your neighbors and it pouring with rain in BP every morning.

Sarcasm aside, my primary objection is that people resort to their cars in the first instance rather than even consider walking. Convenience becomes the overriding consideration (which also goes to Roy's point because convenience for some = inconvenience for others). It probably isn't coincidental that the average person's weight in the UK continues to increase and children's amount of daily exercise decrease as the 'car culture' takes hold. It's not the only factor, but it certainly contributes.

You take your children on countryside walks, but many others don't. This is not a personal attack on your actions, but rather a broader commentary about the way that UK society is going / has gone.
 

Offline Bob Horrocks

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Re: School Coaches
« Reply #51 on: March 21, 2008, 02:38:07 pm »
AK suggests taking your family on a countryside walk.  There are twelve excellent local walks on this website.  Click on 'walks' in the front page heading at the right hand end of the various links.

Offline AK

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Re: School Coaches
« Reply #52 on: March 22, 2008, 01:07:34 pm »
Absolutely. Directions for the walks are quite clear, the countryside is fabulous and (best of all) there is always a pub on the route.
 

Offline Bob Horrocks

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Re: School Coaches
« Reply #53 on: March 25, 2008, 12:37:36 pm »
Dave knew what he was doing when he planned those routes    ;D

Offline speerchucker

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Re: School Coaches
« Reply #54 on: March 25, 2008, 06:10:15 pm »
I do sympathise with the views expressed about the busses and cars.  However, my daughter catches one of the buses and walks to the stop (Mymms/Moffats) with a friend.  Some of those who catch the bus at that stop come from considerable distances to get there eg between Newgate St and Wild Hill as this is their nearest stop. Walking is not a feasible alternative.

While it would be lovely to live in an ideal world where our kids had a genuine option of a place at a local school (choice, ha!) and were able to walk there,  this is no longer the case.  Also they are frequently/usually required to carry bags in axcess of 30lb each day, moving the bus stop an extra mile to Bradmore Green would result in more cares not fewer (ah but not in my back yard!). 

For us old gits who believe that the school system still works the way it did in the good (?) old days, we need to have the delight of following a kid through today's shambles of an admission and tuition system to see why we have the need for buses and driving to those buses.

Even then I agree that there have always been and always will be inconsiderate gas bags of both sexes who obstruct us grumpy old folks from going about our business.  Separate point regardless of the school bus issue

Chucker
 

Offline stevea

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Re: School Coaches
« Reply #55 on: March 26, 2008, 05:19:33 am »
If it makes anybody feel better, I live in Brisbane where there is hardly any traffic compared to the UK, and the same thing happens at my daughters school.  Not only do they all seems to own 4x4's but they get out their cars, walk their children to class leaving the car running with the air conditioning blasting!  If you're unfortunate enough to be parked near them you'd die of carbon monoxide poisoning!  I did try to point this out one day and was told where to go with some very choice words! :)
 

Offline Grumpy Old Roy

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Re: School Coaches
« Reply #56 on: March 27, 2008, 06:57:33 pm »

 Totally agree with you Spearchucher, but I am not complaining about the older children, it's the inconsiderate parents of the primary school children who block Bradmore Way every day. Most of the time it is only one child being drooped off, all I am requesting is that a little thought and organisation between the parents could substantially reduce the number of vehicles clogging up this very narrow road.

 I recently had a heart problem which necessitated a paramedic and ambulance, fortunately it was around 10.30 am, had it have happened at 8.45am I might not have been sending this text, (whats that I hear, bloody shame he recovered moaning old @@@@)
.
So, come on parents, organise yourselves, it's to every ones advantage, especially the children.Yes things do change, and must, but good manners can never be changed.

Thanks

Grumpy Old Roy


 

Offline stevea

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Re: School Coaches
« Reply #57 on: March 28, 2008, 06:11:06 am »
The reason why many children don't walk to school anymore is because there seems to be more paedophiles and nutters about these days.  Only the other day where I live a man tried to coax a young girl into his car whilst she was waiting at the bus stop.  As a parent, you have no choice.  You also have to remember that we are now in a very fast paced society with both parents working and whilst there is no excuse for ignorance when parking, to be quite honest, many don't give a stuff. This is a sign of the times. :(
 

Offline AK

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Re: School Coaches
« Reply #58 on: March 28, 2008, 09:00:21 pm »
Perhaps we all feel that life moves faster these days because we're told that by the media at every opportunity. Both my parents worked when I was a child and I still managed to walk to school. Yes, the 2 items are unconnected, although the first one makes a very convenient excuse.
 

Offline stevea

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Re: School Coaches
« Reply #59 on: March 29, 2008, 01:15:29 am »
AK  I used to walk to school, my wife used to walk to school...we would like nothing more than for our daughter to walk to school....but it is simply not safe in today's society. It's certainly not a convenient excuse! Yes the media tells us how fast moving life is, it also informs us of the dangers in society. When we were young this all still existed but we did not have access to media like we do today. I'd rather not take the chance with our daughter, and many parents feel the same.  I couldn't think of anything worse than to have a child go missing.  The risk is too great.   We have a much bigger population today i.e more cars - and the problem of ignorant parking will only get worse.
 

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